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Photography Forum - Your Own Photos - Alchemist - Jun 27, 2020 - 12:17am
 
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Streaming Index for Outlaw Audio RR2160 Tuner - BillG - Jun 25, 2020 - 10:03pm
 
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R_P

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Posted: Jul 1, 2020 - 1:15pm


Donald Trump is bringing his white power revue to Mount Rushmore. This week on Intercepted: As cases of Covid-19 skyrocket across the U.S. — particularly in states that basked in the glory of the Trump administration’s ignorance and anti-science policies — Trump is passionately focused on defending the legacy of the Confederacy and white supremacist monuments. Native American historian Nick Estes explains the crimes against Indigenous people committed by the four presidents whose faces are carved into Mount Rushmore and describes the story of the Native tribes displaced from the Black Hills of South Dakota.

Black Lives Matter demonstrations against police brutality systemic racism continue across the U.S. as calls to defund the police intensify. University of Iowa historian Simon Balto, author of the new book “Occupied Territory: Policing Black Chicago from Red Summer to Black Power,” lays out the origins of the Chicago Police Department as a moralistic enforcement agency in the late 1800s and its transformation into a militarized terror force deployed to systemically and violently control Black people in Chicago, while simultaneously crushing movements for workers’ rights, tenant rights, and basic human rights.

black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Jul 1, 2020 - 12:39pm



 rgio wrote:

 I do think being a racist matters....now more than ever.  Nixon and LBJ are historical figures, and should remain there in the discussion of acceptable behavior in 2020.
 

I agree. But it's still important to put the argument in proper context, historical or otherwise.
rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: Jul 1, 2020 - 12:35pm



 black321 wrote:


 R_P wrote:
 black321 wrote:
it doesnt really matter if trump is a racist, misogynist. these qualities are nothing new in the white house (see clinton, nixon, lbj....).
it matters that he uses racism as part of his politics.

It matters in both cases (esp. as an elected official), and the latter isn't new either.
 

Sure, i'm obviously not saying being a racist is ok.
but lbj passed civil rights laws, but was probably a racist. 
 

And (I think) to your earlier point...if he's a racist and hides it, it's technically not an issue like the suggestion made by the Dems that started this discussion.  What is almost guaranteed, is that he will be "selling" racist support while standing on Native American soil.

I do think being a racist matters....now more than ever.  Nixon and LBJ are historical figures, and should remain there in the discussion of acceptable behavior in 2020.
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Jul 1, 2020 - 12:29pm

 black321 wrote:
 R_P wrote:
 black321 wrote:
it doesnt really matter if trump is a racist, misogynist. these qualities are nothing new in the white house (see clinton, nixon, lbj....).
it matters that he uses racism as part of his politics.

It matters in both cases (esp. as an elected official), and the latter isn't new either.
 
Sure, i'm obviously not saying being a racist is ok.
but lbj passed civil rights laws, but was probably a racist. 
 
Sometimes (supposed) racists (and their policies) are left with no choice. Power isn't given away easily.
black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Jul 1, 2020 - 12:28pm



 steeler wrote:


 black321 wrote:



 
it doesnt really matter if trump is a racist, misogynist. these qualities are nothing new in the white house (see clinton, nixon, lbj....).
it matters that he uses racism as part of his politics.

 
In cases of discrimination, a court takes into account the disparate impact a government action has upon a suspect class. In those cases, it is not necessary to prove that there was an intent to discriminate.

Another thought: Trump’s refusal to wear a mask or even to encourage others to do so. Whatever his intent there, no denying the impact that has had on some members of the population.

 

trump took plaquenil, so one can conclude he was concerned about the virus....
so you could also conclude he used the mask issue for political reasons, and to create more divisiveness
black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Jul 1, 2020 - 12:25pm



 R_P wrote:
 black321 wrote:
it doesnt really matter if trump is a racist, misogynist. these qualities are nothing new in the white house (see clinton, nixon, lbj....).
it matters that he uses racism as part of his politics.

It matters in both cases (esp. as an elected official), and the latter isn't new either.
 

Sure, i'm obviously not saying being a racist is ok.
but lbj passed civil rights laws, but was probably a racist. 
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Jul 1, 2020 - 12:05pm

 black321 wrote:
it doesnt really matter if trump is a racist, misogynist. these qualities are nothing new in the white house (see clinton, nixon, lbj....).
it matters that he uses racism as part of his politics.

It matters in both cases (esp. as an elected official), and the latter isn't new either.
steeler

steeler Avatar

Location: Perched on the precipice of the cauldron of truth


Posted: Jul 1, 2020 - 12:00pm



 black321 wrote:


 rgio wrote:


 kurtster wrote:

Yeah, this is sad but a great one.  Should be campaign material.

This is real and how the DNC really feels about it.  It's just a white supremacist tourist trap in a flyover red state.

Biden will have Mt Rushmore erased by midterms in his first term.  He'll use an executive order and the courts will uphold him.

They said it's only about the Confederacy, but now they're taking down any statue that isn't moving. 

If it has a pigeon sitting on it, it's a target for destruction.

Cannot make this stuff up.  Sigh ...
 

Kurt, you know they have you listed on some board in Siberia as one of the "local actors"?

Look....it was a really foolish thing for the Dems to post, but having said that, let's look at the facts (in roughly reverse order).

Trump is a racist.  Hopefully, we don't need to discuss further.  He's been a racist his entire life.  If you're not willing to accept this as fact, there is no point in continuing.  He is holding a rally during which time he will spew racist ideology....like protecting statues.  I'm not for mobs tearing down statues, but we've reached a point where reflective consideration of who and where statues sit is appropriate.  He could pump the breaks, but instead, he uses inflammatory language in support of racists.  It will be a rally that white supremacists support the message...so it's intentionally or unintentionally a white nationalist rally.

It is taking place on Native American lands.  Those Native Americans have been the target of Republican attempts to make voting more difficult.  Take a look at North Dakota over the past decade if you're not sure.  The only thing left to ensure the integrity of the very important elections in ND are a retinal scan and facial recognition.  

As for the COVID support, even though $8B was part of the Cares relief package, the Tribes has to file a lawsuit to get the feds to release the money in May.

So let's review...

Trump has disrespected Native communities time and again - True
He's attempted to limit voting rights and blocked critical pandemic relief - True and True
He's holding a rally glorifying white supremacy on once-sacred tribal lands - Extremely likely

On a factual scale, that tweet was about an 8 or 9 out of 10. 

People should definitely stop destroying statues independently, but it wasn't part of the tweet.  Neither was there any mention of the courts.  You'll get extra points in Russia for remembering a dog whistle subject in your post (judges).  If only you would have woven a bit of abortion rhetoric into the conversation, you would have made the refrigerator.   Next time...
 
it doesnt really matter if trump is a racist, misogynist. these qualities are nothing new in the white house (see clinton, nixon, lbj....).
it matters that he uses racism as part of his politics.

 
In cases of discrimination, a court takes into account the disparate impact a government action has upon a suspect class. In those cases, it is not necessary to prove that there was an intent to discriminate.

Another thought: Trump’s refusal to wear a mask or even to encourage others to do so. Whatever his intent there, no denying the impact that has had on some members of the population.

hayduke2

hayduke2 Avatar

Location: Southampton, NY
Gender: Male


Posted: Jul 1, 2020 - 11:43am

Why Does Trump Love Putin So Much?

https://www.motherjones.com/po...

black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Jul 1, 2020 - 10:52am



 rgio wrote:


 kurtster wrote:

Yeah, this is sad but a great one.  Should be campaign material.

This is real and how the DNC really feels about it.  It's just a white supremacist tourist trap in a flyover red state.

Biden will have Mt Rushmore erased by midterms in his first term.  He'll use an executive order and the courts will uphold him.

They said it's only about the Confederacy, but now they're taking down any statue that isn't moving. 

If it has a pigeon sitting on it, it's a target for destruction.

Cannot make this stuff up.  Sigh ...
 

Kurt, you know they have you listed on some board in Siberia as one of the "local actors"?

Look....it was a really foolish thing for the Dems to post, but having said that, let's look at the facts (in roughly reverse order).

Trump is a racist.  Hopefully, we don't need to discuss further.  He's been a racist his entire life.  If you're not willing to accept this as fact, there is no point in continuing.  He is holding a rally during which time he will spew racist ideology....like protecting statues.  I'm not for mobs tearing down statues, but we've reached a point where reflective consideration of who and where statues sit is appropriate.  He could pump the breaks, but instead, he uses inflammatory language in support of racists.  It will be a rally that white supremacists support the message...so it's intentionally or unintentionally a white nationalist rally.

It is taking place on Native American lands.  Those Native Americans have been the target of Republican attempts to make voting more difficult.  Take a look at North Dakota over the past decade if you're not sure.  The only thing left to ensure the integrity of the very important elections in ND are a retinal scan and facial recognition.  

As for the COVID support, even though $8B was part of the Cares relief package, the Tribes has to file a lawsuit to get the feds to release the money in May.

So let's review...

Trump has disrespected Native communities time and again - True
He's attempted to limit voting rights and blocked critical pandemic relief - True and True
He's holding a rally glorifying white supremacy on once-sacred tribal lands - Extremely likely

On a factual scale, that tweet was about an 8 or 9 out of 10. 

People should definitely stop destroying statues independently, but it wasn't part of the tweet.  Neither was there any mention of the courts.  You'll get extra points in Russia for remembering a dog whistle subject in your post (judges).  If only you would have woven a bit of abortion rhetoric into the conversation, you would have made the refrigerator.   Next time...
 
it doesnt really matter if trump is a racist, misogynist. these qualities are nothing new in the white house (see clinton, nixon, lbj....).
it matters that he uses racism as part of his politics.

rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: Jul 1, 2020 - 5:23am



 kurtster wrote:

Yeah, this is sad but a great one.  Should be campaign material.

This is real and how the DNC really feels about it.  It's just a white supremacist tourist trap in a flyover red state.

Biden will have Mt Rushmore erased by midterms in his first term.  He'll use an executive order and the courts will uphold him.

They said it's only about the Confederacy, but now they're taking down any statue that isn't moving. 

If it has a pigeon sitting on it, it's a target for destruction.

Cannot make this stuff up.  Sigh ...
 

Kurt, you know they have you listed on some board in Siberia as one of the "local actors"?

Look....it was a really foolish thing for the Dems to post, but having said that, let's look at the facts (in roughly reverse order).

Trump is a racist.  Hopefully, we don't need to discuss further.  He's been a racist his entire life.  If you're not willing to accept this as fact, there is no point in continuing.  He is holding a rally during which time he will spew racist ideology....like protecting statues.  I'm not for mobs tearing down statues, but we've reached a point where reflective consideration of who and where statues sit is appropriate.  He could pump the breaks, but instead, he uses inflammatory language in support of racists.  It will be a rally that white supremacists support the message...so it's intentionally or unintentionally a white nationalist rally.

It is taking place on Native American lands.  Those Native Americans have been the target of Republican attempts to make voting more difficult.  Take a look at North Dakota over the past decade if you're not sure.  The only thing left to ensure the integrity of the very important elections in ND are a retinal scan and facial recognition.  

As for the COVID support, even though $8B was part of the Cares relief package, the Tribes has to file a lawsuit to get the feds to release the money in May.

So let's review...

Trump has disrespected Native communities time and again - True
He's attempted to limit voting rights and blocked critical pandemic relief - True and True
He's holding a rally glorifying white supremacy on once-sacred tribal lands - Extremely likely

On a factual scale, that tweet was about an 8 or 9 out of 10. 

People should definitely stop destroying statues independently, but it wasn't part of the tweet.  Neither was there any mention of the courts.  You'll get extra points in Russia for remembering a dog whistle subject in your post (judges).  If only you would have woven a bit of abortion rhetoric into the conversation, you would have made the refrigerator.   Next time...
kurtster

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Location: drifting
Gender: Male


Posted: Jul 1, 2020 - 12:08am

 KarmaKarma wrote:

Now here's a Tweet the Dems posted yesterday - and then hastily deleted.  According to the Democrats, the Fourth of July is now a racist holiday!

 
Yeah, this is sad but a great one.  Should be campaign material.

This is real and how the DNC really feels about it.  It's just a white supremacist tourist trap in a flyover red state.

Biden will have Mt Rushmore erased by midterms in his first term.  He'll use an executive order and the courts will uphold him.

They said it's only about the Confederacy, but now they're taking down any statue that isn't moving. 

If it has a pigeon sitting on it, it's a target for destruction.

Cannot make this stuff up.  Sigh ...
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Jun 30, 2020 - 11:10pm

The A Team...

Another hero/victim.
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Jun 30, 2020 - 4:29pm

What is he afraid of? He's an honest, morally righteous paragon...
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Jun 30, 2020 - 1:24pm

So why should Iran’s complaint against Trump be so summarily dismissed by Interpol?

Because, as we all discovered in school when we read George Orwell’s ‘Animal Farm,’ some animals are more equal than others.

rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 30, 2020 - 11:49am



 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


 VV wrote:
Trump is currently reviewing possible locations for his future presidential library.


 

*slowclap* that right there is funny.
 
On a sadly serious note.... he's going to put it somewhere right in the middle of NYC (you know...the city in the state he left and screws constantly with policy).  They never appreciated him....so he'll show 'em!  I wouldn't be surprised if he finds a way to make money selling the first few floors of Trump Tower...including the escalator....to the library.

ScottFromWyoming

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Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 30, 2020 - 11:35am



 VV wrote:
Trump is currently reviewing possible locations for his future presidential library.


 

*slowclap* that right there is funny.
rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: Jun 30, 2020 - 11:15am



 kurtster wrote:

A) Wrong, just plain wrong. What this is is the Federal Government stepping up to do what it is supposed to do in the event of a true emergency. Deal with it effectively and prevent people from not seeking medical attention out of fear of costs. And as a result, save lives. This is for the common good of everyone, but that does not make it socialism.

B) Yeah, it's a budget buster, but this is one of those cases that we have a government for and we will all share the burden for this as we should. It has nothing to do with any of the other things you tried to link to it as excessive spending.

C) A fascist authoritarian would order everyone to wear masks without redress. Under the guise that the masks alone would be enough to stop the spread and make medical care unnecessary ? Is that what you are advocating ?

We have a serious disagreement with each other.
 
Let's take them in order....

A) the government should backstop this....but if the government is paying all of the expenses for something, isn't is socialized?   

Using some of the original (it's just the flu) Republican banter....less than 1% of the US population has been infected, yet the costs have been billions?  Why should the 99% of us here have to pay for your getting sick?  Especially....since you won't wear a mask (that's not you...Kurt....it's you....independent, free-thinking, liberated American)!   What's worse...the administration has done nothing....NOTHING...to keep costs down.  The great negotiator has given billions to the Chinese who are letting us outbid each other on everything from PPE to the unregulated antibody test kits we let flow in from overseas.  The guy is a walking irony...blame the Chinese for the virus and then send them Billions for snake-oil.  They literally are beating him at his own game.

B) We were increasing the deficit during the "Greatest economy in history".  Not only didn't we build a reserve....we were spending it.  Solid Republican values. 

When the $h*t hit the fan....not only didn't we have money, but he gave it away like a drunken sailor.  Why exactly did we give every person who became unemployed more money than they had ever earned in their lives?  Unemployment rolls will come down over the next month as people actually accept the jobs they had waiting for them.  So...here's a true story....

A friend of mine owns 2 hair salons and has over 100 people who work for him.  The moment he could, he applied for the PPP loans, and actually received them.  Under PPP, his staff were to receive a percentage of their payroll checks for the past XXX (not sure, think it was 2019).  Big problem for them, they earn a lot in tips.  PPP wouldn't address the tips.  They had an all hands Zoom call to announce the PPP loan, and were begged not to open by the staff.  They were each making $700-$1000 from unemployment instead of the $300-$400 they make at work.  Many threatened to claim medical issues if they were asked to come back.  There was anger at him and his wife for suggesting the re-opening.   In the end they decided to keep the PPP money on the side and pay it back if necessary, at a large loss to them.  From what I hear now, he thinks the rules have loosened so that he can keep the money anyway.

These 2 salons in NJ cost the Federal Government almost $1MILLION DOLLARS for the 13 weeks of shut-down/unemployment.  That's double what the businesses bring in during that period.


That is why we are digging a multi-trillion dollar hole.  We aren't managing either the cost of the pandemic support or the programs to support people.  Trump basically harkened back to his strip club days and "made it rain".   BTW - it's obviously an attempt to buy votes in November.  Putting his name on the checks...paying people more than they earn...if only he could have magically made it go away like he planned.

C) Since we're spending all of this money, don't you think he should reinforce his own guidelines and the suggestion of every medical professional on the planet?   There is nothing to lose by wearing a mask.  It should never have been even a topic of discussion, but the idiot in chief just can't imagine looking so weak.  We are all paying for his vanity.

You're right, we don't agree.  You support him, and I believe he has set the country back 75 years.  If he wins again in November, he quit possibly might destroy the place.  
R_P

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Posted: Jun 30, 2020 - 11:02am


R_P

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Posted: Jun 30, 2020 - 10:17am

 VV wrote:
Trump is currently reviewing possible locations for his future presidential library.

 

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