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Index » Radio Paradise/General » General Discussion » Climate Change Page: Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 104, 105, 106 ... 125, 126, 127  Next
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callum

callum Avatar

Location: its wet, windy and chilly....take a guess
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 30, 2009 - 6:58am

 oldslabsides wrote:

*my Upper Palaeolithic hunter/gatherer/anarchist ideals aside for a moment*

If we're going to have government and social manipulation and nanny states, then I am with Robert Heinlein and believe that there should be a strata to that society: those who chose to complete a term of service and thereby earn the privileges of "full" citizenship, and those who chose not to.

The term of service need not be strictly military, but could include pretty much anything the nanny state seeks to accomplish; infrastructure construction/maintenance, social work, etc.  Those completing the term would be able to "own" property, vote, etc.  Those who chose not to cannot "own" property, vote, etc.

I honestly believe that the sheer number of us has created societal problems that didn't exist a few thousand years ago when the entire population of the planet could comfortably reside in say, Rhode Island.

*goes off to shower. ew*
 
In part I agree...but this is well trodden ground for us so I'll leave it at that.
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar

Location: Dumbf*ckistan


Posted: Dec 30, 2009 - 6:00am

 callum wrote:

Pzacly.  I think its the responsibility of my generation to bring back the logic and sense of duty back into public life.  In WWI millions of men my age volunteered out of duty*.  People had a sense of what was right; I wish we could see that again.  With a sense of belonging to a community and of having rights must come a sense of duty to protect and help those who need it.  We have to stand by each other if we want to keep those rights and freedoms we are so fortunate to have.  That doesn't mean joining the army for 3 years before you are 25 (unless you want to), but it means everyone pulling their weight and helping their community out - whether it be helping tidy the local park or visiting the elderly or whatever.  If everyone helped out the world would be a much better place.

*yes, gross oversimplification and yes there was conscription and yes it was terrible since most of them died, but the fact remains - many people volunteered to fight because they saw it as a duty 

 
*my Upper Palaeolithic hunter/gatherer/anarchist ideals aside for a moment*

If we're going to have government and social manipulation and nanny states, then I am with Robert Heinlein and believe that there should be a strata to that society: those who chose to complete a term of service and thereby earn the privileges of "full" citizenship, and those who chose not to.

The term of service need not be strictly military, but could include pretty much anything the nanny state seeks to accomplish; infrastructure construction/maintenance, social work, etc.  Those completing the term would be able to "own" property, vote, etc.  Those who chose not to cannot "own" property, vote, etc.

I honestly believe that the sheer number of us has created societal problems that didn't exist a few thousand years ago when the entire population of the planet could comfortably reside in say, Rhode Island.

*goes off to shower. ew*

callum

callum Avatar

Location: its wet, windy and chilly....take a guess
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 30, 2009 - 5:47am

 oldslabsides wrote:

Truly.

Yes, we could use a bit of Vulcan.  Emotions are wonderful things for personal relationships, appreciating art, music, food etc.  Unfortunately, they have no place in decisions regarding purely mathmatical subjects.  Subjects like, say, finance, engineering and the preservation of the only place in the universe we know of that can support our existence.
 
Pzacly.  I think its the responsibility of my generation to bring back the logic and sense of duty back into public life.  In WWI millions of men my age volunteered out of duty*.  People had a sense of what was right; I wish we could see that again.  With a sense of belonging to a community and of having rights must come a sense of duty to protect and help those who need it.  We have to stand by each other if we want to keep those rights and freedoms we are so fortunate to have.  That doesn't mean joining the army for 3 years before you are 25 (unless you want to), but it means everyone pulling their weight and helping their community out - whether it be helping tidy the local park or visiting the elderly or whatever.  If everyone helped out the world would be a much better place.

edit:  this links into logic (IMO) thus:
People should also have a duty to read and research large issues that they want to have an opinion.  If you are concerned with climate change then take the time to find out something about it.  Don't let other people tell you what you should believe and sway you with emotionally driven arguments.  Additionally a better educated population will have better educated discussions rather than simplifying everything down...
*yes, gross oversimplification and yes there was conscription and yes it was terrible since most of them died, but the fact remains - many people volunteered to fight because they saw it as a duty 


Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar

Location: Dumbf*ckistan


Posted: Dec 30, 2009 - 5:13am

 callum wrote:
 
Indeed.  But logical solutions always seem to be at a disadvantage.  Sometimes I wish we were just a little bit more Vulcan.

 
Truly.

Yes, we could use a bit of Vulcan.  Emotions are wonderful things for personal relationships, appreciating art, music, food etc.  Unfortunately, they have no place in decisions regarding purely mathmatical subjects.  Subjects like, say, finance, engineering and the preservation of the only place in the universe we know of that can support our existence.

callum

callum Avatar

Location: its wet, windy and chilly....take a guess
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 30, 2009 - 4:47am

 hobiejoe wrote:


'Tis true 'nuff, but the deniers are very keen to cast the argument in those terms - to avoid the science and to blame the need to cut emissions on freedom-hating tree-huggers and green lefties, or lefty greenies or whatever. That these weirdo communist "world scientific community" commies are conspiring to take away your freedoms, even though a pretty sybaritic American Lifestyle™ could easily be maintained without frying the planet if only fossil fuels were taken/priced out of the market.
 
Hmmmph. Sounds like a new front is being opened in the Culture Wars.
 
And I've also gotten too serious......
  
"Time for bed" said Florence...
 
"Boinnnnggg" said Zebadee.

 
 
   
 
Indeed.  But logical solutions always seem to be at a disadvantage.  Sometimes I wish we were just a little bit more Vulcan.


NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 4:10pm

 dionysius wrote:


'Night! And for the irony-challenged? Screw 'em! The Culture Wars will be overtaken by Reality Wars soon enough, alas.

 
Too late.

Welly

Welly Avatar

Location: Lotusland
Gender: Female


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 4:10pm

 jadewahoo wrote:
 oldslabsides wrote:

All the energy we generate using fossil fuels is releasing energy that's been stored in the earth for millennia. Plentiful, but definitely finite.  Meanwhile, the sun is pouring more energy than we could possibly use on a daily basis onto the planet every day.  Releasing all that stored energy has a lot of negative effects, finding an efficient way to use the sun's energy is imperative.
We could set up big magnifying lenses in space and zap all the ignorant asshats with the focused rays of the sun.

 
oooh — Schlabby and Jade for Prez and VP!

dionysius

dionysius Avatar

Location: The People's Republic of Austin
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 4:04pm

 hobiejoe wrote:


'Tis true 'nuff, but the deniers are very keen to cast the argument in those terms - to avoid the science and to blame the need to cut emissions on freedom-hating tree-huggers and green lefties, or lefty greenies or whatever. That these weirdo communist "world scientific community" commies are conspiring to take away your freedoms, even though a pretty sybaritic American Lifestyle™ could easily be maintained without frying the planet if only fossil fuels were taken/priced out of the market.
 
Hmmmph. Sounds like a new front is being opened in the Culture Wars.
 
And I've also gotten too serious......
  
"Time for bed" said Florence...
 
"Boinnnnggg" said Zebadee.

 
 
   

 

'Night! And for the irony-challenged? Screw 'em! The Culture Wars will be overtaken by Reality Wars soon enough, alas.
hobiejoe

hobiejoe Avatar

Location: Still in the tunnel, looking for the light.
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 3:45pm

 dionysius wrote:

Gracious, he's sounds just like one of us tree-hugging Green lefties now, doesn't he?
 

'Tis true 'nuff, but the deniers are very keen to cast the argument in those terms - to avoid the science and to blame the need to cut emissions on freedom-hating tree-huggers and green lefties, or lefty greenies or whatever. That these weirdo communist "world scientific community" commies are conspiring to take away your freedoms, even though a pretty sybaritic American Lifestyle™ could easily be maintained without frying the planet if only fossil fuels were taken/priced out of the market.
 
Hmmmph. Sounds like a new front is being opened in the Culture Wars.
 
And I've also gotten too serious......
  
"Time for bed" said Florence...
 
"Boinnnnggg" said Zebadee.

 
 
   
NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 3:42pm

 maryte wrote:


{#Mrgreen}

 


maryte

maryte Avatar

Location: Blinding You With Library Science!
Gender: Female


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 3:41pm

 dionysius wrote:

Why are you channeling my wife?
 

{#Mrgreen}
dionysius

dionysius Avatar

Location: The People's Republic of Austin
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 3:37pm

 NoEnzLefttoSplit wrote:

Whadda you mean "us" white man?

hoping you all get reference to obscure joke



 
Why are you channeling my wife?

NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 3:33pm

 dionysius wrote:

Gracious, he's sounds just like one of us tree-hugging Green lefties now, doesn't he?
 
Whadda you mean "us" white man?

hoping you all get reference to obscure joke




Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar

Location: Dumbf*ckistan


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 3:32pm

 dionysius wrote:

Gracious, he's sounds just like one of us tree-hugging Green lefties now, doesn't he?
 
No need to get nasty now.

dionysius

dionysius Avatar

Location: The People's Republic of Austin
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 3:30pm

 hobiejoe wrote:


There it is, beautifully put, plain and simple.
 

 
Gracious, he's sounds just like one of us tree-hugging Green lefties now, doesn't he?

hobiejoe

hobiejoe Avatar

Location: Still in the tunnel, looking for the light.
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 3:22pm

 oldslabsides wrote:

All the energy we generate using fossil fuels is releasing energy that's been stored in the earth for millennia. Plentiful, but definitely finite.  Meanwhile, the sun is pouring more energy than we could possibly use on a daily basis onto the planet every day.  Releasing all that stored energy has a lot of negative effects, finding an efficient way to use the sun's energy is imperative.
 

There it is, beautifully put, plain and simple.
 
maryte

maryte Avatar

Location: Blinding You With Library Science!
Gender: Female


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 3:13pm

 lowelltr wrote:


All true comments - IF there is a "water problem", it's one humans have always had, and is one not of supply, but of distribution.......

 

No.  The greater the population grows, the greater the supply problem becomes.  Simple math, not-so-simple solutions.
lowelltr

lowelltr Avatar

Location: Cardinal Nation
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 2:59pm

 Lazy8 wrote:
 MrsHobieJoe wrote:
I thought that the earth is NOT a closed system because we have the sun's energy coming in.

There is a pretty big issue though with the water and the people being in different places and more people and people having a higher water consumption.

A better choice of words would be running out of drinkable water. And that will always be a localized problem—"the world" is not running out of water.
 

All true comments - IF there is a "water problem", it's one humans have always had, and is one not of supply, but of distribution.......
HazzeSwede

HazzeSwede Avatar

Location: Hammerdal
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 10:37am

 jadewahoo wrote:
 oldslabsides wrote:

All the energy we generate using fossil fuels is releasing energy that's been stored in the earth for millennia. Plentiful, but definitely finite.  Meanwhile, the sun is pouring more energy than we could possibly use on a daily basis onto the planet every day.  Releasing all that stored energy has a lot of negative effects, finding an efficient way to use the sun's energy is imperative.
We could set up big magnifying lenses in space and zap all the ignorant asshats with the focused rays of the sun.

 
  Watch out US !!{#Lol}
jadewahoo

jadewahoo Avatar

Location: Puerto Viejo, Costa Rica
Gender: Male


Posted: Dec 29, 2009 - 9:24am

 oldslabsides wrote:

All the energy we generate using fossil fuels is releasing energy that's been stored in the earth for millennia. Plentiful, but definitely finite.  Meanwhile, the sun is pouring more energy than we could possibly use on a daily basis onto the planet every day.  Releasing all that stored energy has a lot of negative effects, finding an efficient way to use the sun's energy is imperative.
We could set up big magnifying lenses in space and zap all the ignorant asshats with the focused rays of the sun.


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