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Index »
Radio Paradise/General »
General Discussion »
COVID-19
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Page: Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 ... 395, 396, 397 Next |
kurtster
Location: where fear is not a virtue Gender:
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Posted:
Jul 26, 2023 - 12:27am |
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Steely_D wrote: miamizsun wrote: if i tested positive, i'd take it in a heartbeat I have colleagues who are - ahem - by the book. And I get it. We're a nation of laws! But I'm fairly generous and flexible. Not as generous as places like Mexico where you buy antibiotics OTC in a pharmacy - that's really wrong. But although proven guidelines for things like upper respiratory infections say that sooner than a week it's typically viral and antibiotics are useless, if someone's worsening and it's been 4-5 days, I set them up. (A relative who's really sick right now saw someone in clinic who told her to "come back in two weeks" if she wasn't improved. That's begging to turn a minimal problem into a serious one. Bad practice, that is... mal practice.) I have had Paxlovid. When my Mom, the wife and I all came down with I'm guessing due to when, the Omicron version. Called my onc to advise of positive test and the protocol had just changed to using Paxlovid. They overnighted it to me from the CCF's pharmacy. Our GP called it in to our pharmacy the next day for P. Don't remember what my Mom got. Was fast acting and relatively mild throughout the usage.
Was very leery of another anti viral after having a horrible experience with Tamiflu. Two days in, I felt like I wanted to crawl out of my skin and stopped it, STAT. I will never use Tamiflu again.
Given the need, I would not hesitate to take Paxlovid again.
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Steely_D
Location: Biscayne Bay Gender:
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Posted:
Jul 25, 2023 - 3:53pm |
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miamizsun wrote:
if i tested positive, i'd take it in a heartbeat
I have colleagues who are - ahem - by the book. And I get it. We're a nation of laws! But I'm fairly generous and flexible. Not as generous as places like Mexico where you buy antibiotics OTC in a pharmacy - that's really wrong. But although proven guidelines for things like upper respiratory infections say that sooner than a week it's typically viral and antibiotics are useless, if someone's worsening and it's been 4-5 days, I set them up. (A relative who's really sick right now saw someone in clinic who told her to "come back in two weeks" if she wasn't improved. That's begging to turn a minimal problem into a serious one. Bad practice, that is... mal practice.)
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miamizsun
Location: (3283.1 Miles SE of RP) Gender:
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Posted:
Jul 25, 2023 - 1:54pm |
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Steely_D wrote:
Feeling a little vindicated. I've been using Paxlovid on anyone, any age, even though guidelines have been that it's for a select, high risk group of people (old, fragile, etc). But there was a suggestion that it had few side effects (more likely: metallic taste in mouth) and might have a role in decreasing Long Covid.
Now, there's more suggestion that it's good to protect against the Long, and even in younglings.
"On average, the drug lowered the relative risk of developing the conditions by 26 percent"
if i tested positive, i'd take it in a heartbeat
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Steely_D
Location: Biscayne Bay Gender:
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Posted:
Jul 25, 2023 - 1:43pm |
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Feeling a little vindicated. I've been using Paxlovid on anyone, any age, even though guidelines have been that it's for a select, high risk group of people (old, fragile, etc). But there was a suggestion that it had few side effects (more likely: metallic taste in mouth) and might have a role in decreasing Long Covid.
Now, there's more suggestion that it's good to protect against the Long, and even in younglings.
"On average, the drug lowered the relative risk of developing the conditions by 26 percent"
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R_P
Gender:
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kurtster
Location: where fear is not a virtue Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 28, 2023 - 4:09pm |
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islander wrote: kurtster wrote: Sorry to hear that. I just saw a piece where the first recorded case dates back to 2017. That case was the inspiration for starting the gain of function research. Here is another source regarding 2017. Coronavirus was flagged as early as 2017 Make of it what you will. What? Not exactly sure what you are saying here, but I'm pretty sure that's not correct. GOF has been under development (generally) for a while (see below) and specifically for corona viruses well before this incident. This case is when the gain of function research on this particular Corona Virus began, not when GOF research itself began. I did not think it was necessary to say that since this is the COVID thread. GOF research began immediately on it's discovery because it was the ideal candidate to exploit. And exploit it they did. Better now ? You really need to get a hobby if all you have to keep your life interesting is stalking me. Now back to you ... so when again exactly did you stop beating your wife ?
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R_P
Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 26, 2023 - 1:59pm |
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ScottFromWyoming wrote:
In other news, Covid-19 still sucks but not as bad as it did when I had it two years ago. No idea what variant/subvariant I'm fighting, but it's after several boosters so it could be a mix of "milder" disease + improved resistance to it. The bad news is I was at Disneyland while I was most contagious. Mild symptoms started later (Disneyland is hard work so aches and pains were expected, and sleeping in A/C caused congestion/sniffles...or not) and we were on to other adventures when I finally decided to take a test. That T-Line went black before the liquid even got to the C-Line.
And still to be avoided where/when possible.
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Steely_D
Location: Biscayne Bay Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 26, 2023 - 1:29pm |
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ScottFromWyoming wrote:The bad news is I was at Disneyland while I was most contagious. Mild symptoms started later (Disneyland is hard work so aches and pains were expected, and sleeping in A/C caused congestion/sniffles...or not) and we were on to other adventures when I finally decided to take a test. That T-Line went black before the liquid even got to the C-Line.
Sorry to hear. And back in Mar 2020 we were wrapping up a three days at Disneyland when it felled me. Couldn't walk to the hotel a few blocks away. Fortunately, we'd finished the last ride (Rise of the Resistance). Laid in the hotel room and thought I was gonna break a rib from the coughing. The Better Half⢠didn't seem to get it, tho. But I can see how it killed people; it was much different than the current flu-like version.
And imagine if it had been killing the unborn and small children. What a different response we would have had, right? Instead, it was just the weak and old - so who really cares?
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ScottFromWyoming
Location: Powell Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 26, 2023 - 12:43pm |
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kurtster wrote:
Sorry to hear that.
I just saw a piece where the first recorded case dates back to 2017. That case was the inspiration for starting the gain of function research.
Here is another source regarding 2017.
Coronavirus was flagged as early as 2017
Make of it what you will.
While "Spanish Flu" is a nonsense term, identical in its scapegoating as "China Virus," it's a little bit helpful in how it lessens confusion about whether we're talking about the pathogen or the disease. This article is from the Early Days of the pandemic, and is guilty of oversimplifying a complicated subject. It uses "coronavirus" to mean the current SARS-CoV-2 pathogen, OR the disease it causes, OR the class of viruses to which it belongs. What happened in 2017 was the acknowledgment that coronavirus diseases in humans and domestic animals wasn't well studied, but SARS and MERS were wakeup calls that we needed to have a much better understanding of them.
I very very strongly recommend reading two or more books by David Quammen (specifically the two on viruses, but his books on other subjects are equally remarkable)
Spillover described the mechanism at work when disease moves (suddenly and without precedent) from one type of animal (where it's not causing a problem) to another (where it causes disease). It's gross to read. It came out 10 years ago and he admirably refrained from saying "I told you so," but when 2020 rolled around and someone asked him what his advice was, he said, "Don't eat bats."
The second book, Breathless, is somewhat of a follow-up but gets very deeply into the weeds of what happened and when, before and during the pandemic. He devotes a lot of the book to discussing Shi Zhengli and the Wuhan scenario, and gives a much more comprehensive picture of what she was up to. Quammen began compiling notes for the book very early in the pandemic, and conducted a lot of interviews as it unfolded. It was released in October '22.
(gift link to NYTimes review of Breathless should be readable by anyone)
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islander
Location: West coast somewhere Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 26, 2023 - 11:55am |
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kurtster wrote:
Sorry to hear that.
I just saw a piece where the first recorded case dates back to 2017. That case was the inspiration for starting the gain of function research.
Here is another source regarding 2017.
Coronavirus was flagged as early as 2017
Make of it what you will.
What? Not exactly sure what you are saying here, but I'm pretty sure that's not correct. GOF has been under development (generally) for a while (see below) and specifically for corona viruses well before this incident.
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kurtster
Location: where fear is not a virtue Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 26, 2023 - 11:47am |
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ScottFromWyoming wrote: R_P wrote: IMO we won't find a definitive patient zero because identical or nearly identical mutations occurred in two or more places, nearly simultaneously. ============= In other news, Covid-19 still sucks but not as bad as it did when I had it two years ago. No idea what variant/subvariant I'm fighting, but it's after several boosters so it could be a mix of "milder" disease + improved resistance to it. The bad news is I was at Disneyland while I was most contagious. Mild symptoms started later (Disneyland is hard work so aches and pains were expected, and sleeping in A/C caused congestion/sniffles...or not) and we were on to other adventures when I finally decided to take a test. That T-Line went black before the liquid even got to the C-Line. Sorry to hear that. I just saw a piece where the first recorded case dates back to 2017. That case was the inspiration for starting the gain of function research. Here is another source regarding 2017. Coronavirus was flagged as early as 2017Make of it what you will.
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ScottFromWyoming
Location: Powell Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 26, 2023 - 11:27am |
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R_P wrote:
IMO we won't find a definitive patient zero because identical or nearly identical mutations occurred in two or more places, nearly simultaneously.
=============
In other news, Covid-19 still sucks but not as bad as it did when I had it two years ago. No idea what variant/subvariant I'm fighting, but it's after several boosters so it could be a mix of "milder" disease + improved resistance to it. The bad news is I was at Disneyland while I was most contagious. Mild symptoms started later (Disneyland is hard work so aches and pains were expected, and sleeping in A/C caused congestion/sniffles...or not) and we were on to other adventures when I finally decided to take a test. That T-Line went black before the liquid even got to the C-Line.
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R_P
Gender:
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oldviolin
Location: esse quam videri Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 23, 2023 - 7:01am |
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islander wrote: lily34 wrote:wow. wow. this may be a very silly question, but why are there government grants for research on manipulation of viruses to make them more dangerous? am i stupid for asking this? I have a friend who used to be involved in this, so here's my once interpreted shorthand: Gain of function covers a whole range of things, but basically means they are making changes to the virus to do different things than it normally does. There are two main reasons to do this: 1) new applications. There is a relatively new group of therapeutical that use virus vectors as a delivery method. They are working on treatments for MS, Cancers and many other things that use viruses to deliver their payloads to cells. This is very effective and has a lot of promise. 2) Research in general - an example: the major strain of flu that we deal with only really infects us and harbor seals, neither of which are very good research subjects. So they have used gain of function to modify the virus so that it will also infect rabbits. They have also made it more virulent, so that modeling on spread and impact can be done faster. This research is used to develop the annual flu vaccines that save thousands of lives every year. I guess the next question (rhetorical) would be why does all that seemingly beneficial research need to be done and/or paid for in secret by a lab in another often adversarial country with no independent oversight or transparency?
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lily34
Location: GTFO Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 23, 2023 - 6:39am |
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islander wrote:
I have a friend who used to be involved in this, so here's my once interpreted shorthand: Gain of function covers a whole range of things, but basically means they are making changes to the virus to do different things than it normally does. There are two main reasons to do this: 1) new applications. There is a relatively new group of therapeutical that use virus vectors as a delivery method. They are working on treatments for MS, Cancers and many other things that use viruses to deliver their payloads to cells. This is very effective and has a lot of promise. 2) Research in general - an example: the major strain of flu that we deal with only really infects us and harbor seals, neither of which are very good research subjects. So they have used gain of function to modify the virus so that it will also infect rabbits. They have also made it more virulent, so that modeling on spread and impact can be done faster. This research is used to develop the annual flu vaccines that save thousands of lives every year.
thank you for this. i figured i was missing something. it didn't occur to me that by making something worse, you could find cures. i am not sure why i didn't get there.
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islander
Location: West coast somewhere Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 23, 2023 - 6:36am |
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lily34 wrote:
wow. wow.
this may be a very silly question, but why are there government grants for research on manipulation of viruses to make them more dangerous? am i stupid for asking this?
I have a friend who used to be involved in this, so here's my once interpreted shorthand: Gain of function covers a whole range of things, but basically means they are making changes to the virus to do different things than it normally does. There are two main reasons to do this: 1) new applications. There is a relatively new group of therapeutical that use virus vectors as a delivery method. They are working on treatments for MS, Cancers and many other things that use viruses to deliver their payloads to cells. This is very effective and has a lot of promise. 2) Research in general - an example: the major strain of flu that we deal with only really infects us and harbor seals, neither of which are very good research subjects. So they have used gain of function to modify the virus so that it will also infect rabbits. They have also made it more virulent, so that modeling on spread and impact can be done faster. This research is used to develop the annual flu vaccines that save thousands of lives every year.
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oldviolin
Location: esse quam videri Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 23, 2023 - 6:13am |
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lily34 wrote: miamizsun wrote:? Confirmation of Wuhan scientists as "patients zero" makes the lab leak theory look likely—and the misinformation police look like fools.The lab leak theory of COVID-19's origins gained tremendous legitimacy this week as The Wall Street Journal confirmed independent reports that the earliest outbreak occurred at the Wuhan Institute of Virology in November 2019."Patients zero" are now presumed to be three Chinese scientists, including Ben Hu, who worked extensively on gain-of-function research (the manipulation of viruses to make them more dangerous), which was funded by grants from the U.S. government. Those cases occurred in November 2019—well before the Huanan wet market outbreak favored by some in the scientific community as the more likely origin story—and they occurred among the very people one would predict if the virus originated in a lab. This is quite damning, to say the least. Anyone still clinging to an animal origin theory—remember the pangolins and raccoon dogs?—is running up against Occam's razor. Assuming the intelligence reports are accurate and that Hu and his colleagues did contract the earliest cases of COVID-19, the implications are huge. This would mean that substandard safety protocols at the Wuhan lab probably unleashed a killer pathogen on the rest of the planet, and the Chinese government attempted to cover it up. wow. wow. this may be a very silly question, but why are there government grants for research on manipulation of viruses to make them more dangerous? am i stupid for asking this? Seems like those millions would be better spent on research to find out why governments lie and destroy lives and make individuals accountable along with the mass media that helps promote those lies.
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lily34
Location: GTFO Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 23, 2023 - 5:23am |
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miamizsun wrote:
?
Confirmation of Wuhan scientists as "patients zero" makes the lab leak theory look likelyâand the misinformation police look like fools.
The lab leak theory of COVID-19's origins gained tremendous legitimacy this week as The Wall Street Journal confirmed independent reports that the earliest outbreak occurred at the Wuhan Institute of Virology in November 2019.
"Patients zero" are now presumed to be three Chinese scientists, including Ben Hu, who worked extensively on gain-of-function research (the manipulation of viruses to make them more dangerous), which was funded by grants from the U.S. government. Those cases occurred in November 2019âwell before the Huanan wet market outbreak favored by some in the scientific community as the more likely origin storyâand they occurred among the very people one would predict if the virus originated in a lab. This is quite damning, to say the least. Anyone still clinging to an animal origin theoryâremember the pangolins and raccoon dogs?âis running up against Occam's razor.
Assuming the intelligence reports are accurate and that Hu and his colleagues did contract the earliest cases of COVID-19, the implications are huge. This would mean that substandard safety protocols at the Wuhan lab probably unleashed a killer pathogen on the rest of the planet, and the Chinese government attempted to cover it up.
wow. wow.
this may be a very silly question, but why are there government grants for research on manipulation of viruses to make them more dangerous? am i stupid for asking this?
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miamizsun
Location: (3283.1 Miles SE of RP) Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 22, 2023 - 3:14pm |
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??
Confirmation of Wuhan scientists as "patients zero" makes the lab leak theory look likelyâand the misinformation police look like fools.
The lab leak theory of COVID-19's origins gained tremendous legitimacy this week as The Wall Street Journal confirmed independent reports that the earliest outbreak occurred at the Wuhan Institute of Virology in November 2019.
"Patients zero" are now presumed to be three Chinese scientists, including Ben Hu, who worked extensively on gain-of-function research (the manipulation of viruses to make them more dangerous), which was funded by grants from the U.S. government. Those cases occurred in November 2019âwell before the Huanan wet market outbreak favored by some in the scientific community as the more likely origin storyâand they occurred among the very people one would predict if the virus originated in a lab. This is quite damning, to say the least. Anyone still clinging to an animal origin theoryâremember the pangolins and raccoon dogs?âis running up against Occam's razor.
Assuming the intelligence reports are accurate and that Hu and his colleagues did contract the earliest cases of COVID-19, the implications are huge. This would mean that substandard safety protocols at the Wuhan lab probably unleashed a killer pathogen on the rest of the planet, and the Chinese government attempted to cover it up.
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islander
Location: West coast somewhere Gender:
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Posted:
Jun 12, 2023 - 1:50pm |
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black321 wrote:
That view might apply to the initial stimulus (PPP, Main st lending, TALF...) issued early in Mar, Apr 2020, but you then had the late 2020 through 2022 spending that allowed plenty of time for proper oversight, and there wasnt. The effect was $ out the window...and where did it go? Retail sales, home remodeling, and then ultimately travel. There is still over $500B in excess savings (at this point, held by the more well off upper percentile). There was the theft and there was the wasteful spending, sending checks to households that didnt need it, rampant unemployment scams (word spread quick among college students that all you needed to do was apply and they'd send you checks, even going back to Mar 2020)... No, they had plenty of time to drop the shotgun and pick up the rifle to take better aim.
Sure, but I still say the overall number isn't that bad for a government run stimulus program. I bet a decent audit would find at least that much with your average disaster response. And that is a cumulative number, did they start bad and improve? WA state was able to claw back several billion (of the many more billion) dollars in unemployment fraud toward the end of the program.
Good/fast/cheap. We got adequate, timely and spendy, but we did mostly save the economy. I'd also really appreciate a bit more sunshine on those in congress who got those loans (and then got them forgiven) - I'd bet you'll find a lot more shadiness in that batch than average. But hey, maybe we'll do better next pandemic.
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