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Index » Regional/Local » USA/Canada » Looting & vandalism isn't protest Page: Previous  1, 2, 3, ... 22, 23, 24  Next
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KarmaKarma

KarmaKarma Avatar



Posted: Sep 18, 2020 - 9:43pm



 islander wrote:


 KarmaKarma wrote:
There's a whole bunch of screaming and threats of riots & "burning it all down" from the blue checks on Twitter re the passing of RBG.

If the left thinks the American public is going to tolerate any more rioting, arson, & general anarchy, they have seriously misread the mood.

Rioting & general anarchy at this point will only play into Trump's hands - and push more voters into his column.  And any more of it will likely be shut down HARD by either the citizens or law enforcement - OR BOTH.  Enough is enough.

My two cents



 

Not worth that much. Where do I apply for a refund?
 

That's what I paid to post it.  Try asking the proprietor for a refund.
islander

islander Avatar

Location: Seattle
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 18, 2020 - 9:40pm



 KarmaKarma wrote:
There's a whole bunch of screaming and threats of riots & "burning it all down" from the blue checks on Twitter re the passing of RBG.

If the left thinks the American public is going to tolerate any more rioting, arson, & general anarchy, they have seriously misread the mood.

Rioting & general anarchy at this point will only play into Trump's hands - and push more voters into his column.  And any more of it will likely be shut down HARD by either the citizens or law enforcement - OR BOTH.  Enough is enough.

My two cents



 

Not worth that much. Where do I apply for a refund?
KarmaKarma

KarmaKarma Avatar



Posted: Sep 18, 2020 - 8:20pm

There's a whole bunch of screaming and threats of riots & "burning it all down" from the blue checks on Twitter re the passing of RBG.

If the left thinks the American public is going to tolerate any more rioting, arson, & general anarchy, they have seriously misread the mood.

Rioting & general anarchy at this point will only play into Trump's hands - and push more voters into his column.  And any more of it will likely be shut down HARD by either the citizens or law enforcement - OR BOTH.  Enough is enough.

My two cents


miamizsun

miamizsun Avatar

Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 11, 2020 - 5:47am

some guy's take on theft and arson...

There Is No Defense for Looting

It is one thing to peacefully march against injustice, and quite another to burn down what others built up.

| 9.11.2020 8:00 AM

National Public Radio's interview last month with Vicky Osterweil, author of a new book called "In Defense of Looting," generated so much pushback that the network had to add a clarification providing more "context" to help readers "fully assess" her "controversial" views. But there isn't anything that NPR's editors could do to contextualize Osterweil's dangerous message.

In technical terms, her argument—that the American system of property rights is oppressive and looting and mayhem will bring about positive social change—is nuts. The interview contains myriad quotations that read like a parody from The Babylon Bee. I'm not unhappy that NPR published it, as it's important to know what such people think. But why didn't the interviewer ask any tough questions?

NPR asked Osterweil to talk about rioting as a tactic, in the way a lifestyle reporter might ask a celebrity to talk a little about a new movie. As the author explains, rioting accomplishes "important things." For starters, "It gets people what they need for free immediately, which means that they are capable of living and reproducing their lives without having to rely on jobs or a wage…That's looting's most basic tactical power as a political mode of action."

haresfur

haresfur Avatar

Location: The Golden Triangle
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 11, 2020 - 3:44am



 sirdroseph wrote:

Perhaps you should.  Who knows may even change your perception.
 

Guess I'll just have to rely on first hand accounts from people I trust
sirdroseph

sirdroseph Avatar

Location: Yes
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 11, 2020 - 3:41am

 haresfur wrote:


 kurtster wrote:


Like I said before here and was immediately trashed for saying it, you couldn't pay me to set foot in Portland and many other places now just because I am an old white man.

Called unknowing, coward, afraid and the like. No, I'm just not stupid.

 

That's funny. If it weren't for Covid, I'd jump at the chance to visit Portland. 

There is a difference between being irrational and being stupid.
 
Perhaps you should.  Who knows may even change your perception.
haresfur

haresfur Avatar

Location: The Golden Triangle
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 11, 2020 - 3:07am



 kurtster wrote:


Like I said before here and was immediately trashed for saying it, you couldn't pay me to set foot in Portland and many other places now just because I am an old white man.

Called unknowing, coward, afraid and the like. No, I'm just not stupid.

 

That's funny. If it weren't for Covid, I'd jump at the chance to visit Portland. 

There is a difference between being irrational and being stupid.
kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: drifting
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 10, 2020 - 9:25pm

 KarmaKarma wrote:

Portland's mayor, Ted Wheeler is a secret supporter of Trump!  What other explanation could there possibly be?!


Wheeler: Effective immediately, I am directing the Portland Police Bureau to end the use of CS gas for crowd control until further notice. We need something different. We need it now.

Portland Police Bureau response:

———

Banning the lawful use of CS will make it very difficult to address this kind of violence without resorting to much higher levels of physical force, with a correspondingly elevated risk of serious injury to members of the public and officers. CS, while effective, is a significantly lower level of force than impact weapons, which would very likely be necessary to disperse riotous groups with its prohibition.
We do not want to use gas. We do not want to use any force.

There remains an expectation that police will make arrests for crimes committed in civil disturbance events. The inability to use CS means this task will require higher levels of force to accomplish.

This is at odds with Portland Police Bureau Directive 1010.00, which states in relevant part:

The community expects and the Portland Police Bureau requires that members use only the objectively reasonable force necessary to perform their duties and overcome the threat or resistance of the subject under the totality of the circumstances.

To make an arrest in the middle of a crowd intent on destruction and injuring people, it takes considerable resources—large numbers of officers that we do not have. Not only do we not have enough PPB officers to respond in this manner, our area partners have stated they will not come to our aid, given the climate in Portland.


Police need all kinds of tools and resources to effectively respond to violence perpetrated by groups of people. Lately, it seems more tools have been taken away than added.
There has been mention of research into alternative methods that may prevent the need for greater force. The Police Bureau is in favor of research, but research takes time. Removing tools without well vetted alternatives, with policies and training in place prior to their use, places police and community members at risk. No one has presented a solution of how officers can stop a rioting group who are threatening the lives of those present, especially given that in most of these cases, officers are clearly outnumbered, sometimes by hundreds.

Arson, vandalism, and violence are not going to drive change in this community. A Police Bureau without the necessary tools to protect its own members, or the community it serves, will not successfully help create the space for real change agents to do the hard work they hope to accomplish.

———

RIP PORTLAND.

 
Like I said before here and was immediately trashed for saying it, you couldn't pay me to set foot in Portland and many other places now just because I am an old white man.

Called unknowing, coward, afraid and the like.  No, I'm just not stupid.
R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Sep 10, 2020 - 6:42pm


KarmaKarma

KarmaKarma Avatar



Posted: Sep 10, 2020 - 6:25pm

Portland's mayor, Ted Wheeler is a secret supporter of Trump!  What other explanation could there possibly be?!


Wheeler: Effective immediately, I am directing the Portland Police Bureau to end the use of CS gas for crowd control until further notice. We need something different. We need it now.

Portland Police Bureau response:

———

Banning the lawful use of CS will make it very difficult to address this kind of violence without resorting to much higher levels of physical force, with a correspondingly elevated risk of serious injury to members of the public and officers. CS, while effective, is a significantly lower level of force than impact weapons, which would very likely be necessary to disperse riotous groups with its prohibition.
We do not want to use gas. We do not want to use any force.

There remains an expectation that police will make arrests for crimes committed in civil disturbance events. The inability to use CS means this task will require higher levels of force to accomplish.

This is at odds with Portland Police Bureau Directive 1010.00, which states in relevant part:

The community expects and the Portland Police Bureau requires that members use only the objectively reasonable force necessary to perform their duties and overcome the threat or resistance of the subject under the totality of the circumstances.

To make an arrest in the middle of a crowd intent on destruction and injuring people, it takes considerable resources—large numbers of officers that we do not have. Not only do we not have enough PPB officers to respond in this manner, our area partners have stated they will not come to our aid, given the climate in Portland.


Police need all kinds of tools and resources to effectively respond to violence perpetrated by groups of people. Lately, it seems more tools have been taken away than added.
There has been mention of research into alternative methods that may prevent the need for greater force. The Police Bureau is in favor of research, but research takes time. Removing tools without well vetted alternatives, with policies and training in place prior to their use, places police and community members at risk. No one has presented a solution of how officers can stop a rioting group who are threatening the lives of those present, especially given that in most of these cases, officers are clearly outnumbered, sometimes by hundreds.

Arson, vandalism, and violence are not going to drive change in this community. A Police Bureau without the necessary tools to protect its own members, or the community it serves, will not successfully help create the space for real change agents to do the hard work they hope to accomplish.

———

RIP PORTLAND.


R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Sep 10, 2020 - 12:44pm

Don't, don't, don't, don't believe the hype
Top officials with the Department of Homeland Security directed agency analysts to downplay threats from violent white supremacy and Russian election interference, a Homeland Security official said in a whistle-blower complaint released on Wednesday. (...)

In other instances, the department’s second-highest ranked official, Kenneth T. Cuccinelli II, ordered Mr. Murphy to modify intelligence assessments to make the threat of white supremacy “appear less severe” and include information on violent “left-wing” groups and antifa, according to the complaint, which was filed on Tuesday but released Wednesday by the House Intelligence Committee.

In Mr. Murphy’s account, the two top officials at the department — both appointees of President Trump who have not yet been confirmed by the Senate for their positions — appeared to shape the agency’s views around the president’s language and political interests in ways that stretched the law and their authority.

miamizsun

miamizsun Avatar

Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 5, 2020 - 7:19am

 black321 wrote:
seems the true goal of these protests is being distorted by both sides. And the media

You're Not Allowed To Film': The Fight To Control Who Reports From Portland

Both sides are getting their information through purposely bottlenecked media reports, and the results are predictably distorted and dangerous.


https://reason.com/2020/09/04/...
 

noam chomsky would call all of this crazy manufacturing consent

unfortunately he believes in dialog too

he is now filed under aging wanker
black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 5, 2020 - 7:10am

seems the true goal of these protests is being distorted by both sides. And the media

You're Not Allowed To Film': The Fight To Control Who Reports From Portland

Both sides are getting their information through purposely bottlenecked media reports, and the results are predictably distorted and dangerous.


https://reason.com/2020/09/04/...
kcar

kcar Avatar



Posted: Sep 4, 2020 - 3:13pm



 kurtster wrote:

So that makes the several billions of dollars of estimated damages and losses from the 7 % that were mythically violent protests OK ?

I guess so in your world.

Oh yeah, I forgot.  They have insurance so that makes it OK.
 

My good man, perhaps you'd like to add up the deaths, illnesses and property damage caused by this summer's riots.

THEN compare that number to the deaths, illnesses, business closures and unemployment numbers caused by the coronavirus and Trump's COMPLETE FAILURE to handle the disease and resulting economic damage.

That should provide some much-needed perspective for you. Even though you no longer want to talk about Covid19, the economy or Trump's maximum incompetence.

As Paul Krugman's pointed out
, all Trump has to run on at this point are the mysterious "people in the dark shadows" and debunked claims about Portland being "ablaze all the time." Even that's problematic for Trump, as Krugman notes:

What’s less clear is whether this lie will help Trump, even if people believe it. “America has gone to hell on my watch, so you must re-elect me” isn’t the greatest campaign pitch I can think of.

Have a great Memorial Day weekend. I'm hoping that an extra strong toke will magically change your political views during this break! But we'll still love you if that doesn't happen.

Just don't turn into this guy: 




R_P

R_P Avatar



Posted: Sep 4, 2020 - 12:08pm

 kurtster wrote:
So that makes the several billions of dollars of estimated damages and losses from the 7 % that were mythically violent protests OK ?

Put it on the tab. 12 trillion minus several billions equals 11 trillion and several billions.
Steely_D

Steely_D Avatar

Location: Biscayne Bay
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 4, 2020 - 11:57am



 kurtster wrote:

So that makes the several billions of dollars of estimated damages and losses from the 7 % that were mythically violent protests OK ?
.
 

That’s kinda a non-sequiter.
kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: drifting
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 4, 2020 - 5:19am

 kcar wrote: 
So that makes the several billions of dollars of estimated damages and losses from the 7 % that were mythically violent protests OK ?

I guess so in your world.

Oh yeah, I forgot.  They have insurance so that makes it OK.
miamizsun

miamizsun Avatar

Location: (3261.3 Miles SE of RP)
Gender: Male


Posted: Sep 4, 2020 - 4:22am

 kcar wrote: 
how many violent nutters does it take to ruin a party?

one?

can't have anything nice...
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: Sep 3, 2020 - 7:02pm



 kcar wrote:
 

Imagine that.
kcar

kcar Avatar



Posted: Sep 3, 2020 - 6:41pm


93 percent of protests this summer were peaceful and nondestructive, report says



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