[ ]   [ ]   [ ]                        [ ]      [ ]   [ ]

Trump - rgio - Apr 29, 2025 - 7:15am
 
NYTimes Connections - islander - Apr 29, 2025 - 6:59am
 
NY Times Strands - maryte - Apr 29, 2025 - 6:56am
 
Wordle - daily game - islander - Apr 29, 2025 - 6:50am
 
Radio Paradise Comments - Coaxial - Apr 29, 2025 - 5:50am
 
Democratic Party - kurtster - Apr 28, 2025 - 11:20pm
 
TV shows you watch - islander - Apr 28, 2025 - 8:10pm
 
Ukraine - GeneP59 - Apr 28, 2025 - 7:35pm
 
Photography Forum - Your Own Photos - fractalv - Apr 28, 2025 - 5:36pm
 
Baseball, anyone? - geoff_morphini - Apr 28, 2025 - 5:06pm
 
Talk Behind Their Backs Forum - winter - Apr 28, 2025 - 3:07pm
 
Israel - R_P - Apr 28, 2025 - 3:02pm
 
Canada - R_P - Apr 28, 2025 - 12:56pm
 
Birthday wishes - triskele - Apr 28, 2025 - 9:15am
 
Mixtape Culture Club - ColdMiser - Apr 28, 2025 - 8:08am
 
Today in History - Red_Dragon - Apr 28, 2025 - 6:36am
 
April 2025 Photo Theme - Red - KurtfromLaQuinta - Apr 28, 2025 - 6:30am
 
Live Music - oldviolin - Apr 27, 2025 - 11:37pm
 
New Music - R_P - Apr 27, 2025 - 5:14pm
 
Dialing 1-800-Manbird - oldviolin - Apr 27, 2025 - 4:18pm
 
One Partying State - Wyoming News - ptooey - Apr 27, 2025 - 3:07pm
 
RP app for LG OLED TV - tmarko - Apr 27, 2025 - 5:48am
 
NASA & other news from space - ScottFromWyoming - Apr 26, 2025 - 9:32pm
 
Song of the Day - oldviolin - Apr 26, 2025 - 8:44pm
 
• • • The Once-a-Day • • •  - oldviolin - Apr 26, 2025 - 10:37am
 
M.A.G.A. - Red_Dragon - Apr 26, 2025 - 9:27am
 
The Obituary Page - rgio - Apr 26, 2025 - 5:22am
 
DQ (as in 'Daily Quote') - Isabeau - Apr 26, 2025 - 5:22am
 
Graphs, Charts & Maps - KurtfromLaQuinta - Apr 25, 2025 - 6:42pm
 
Musky Mythology - R_P - Apr 25, 2025 - 4:13pm
 
Anti-War - R_P - Apr 25, 2025 - 4:04pm
 
Who is singing? - ledzeplisa - Apr 25, 2025 - 2:08pm
 
Bug Reports & Feature Requests - R567 - Apr 25, 2025 - 1:54pm
 
Got a Good (True) Ghost Story? - Isabeau - Apr 25, 2025 - 1:27pm
 
President(s) Musk/Trump - Red_Dragon - Apr 24, 2025 - 5:44pm
 
Recommended devices - bluewolverine - Apr 24, 2025 - 5:17pm
 
RightWingNutZ - R_P - Apr 24, 2025 - 4:11pm
 
China - R_P - Apr 24, 2025 - 3:18pm
 
Republican Party - Red_Dragon - Apr 24, 2025 - 3:17pm
 
Economix - Isabeau - Apr 24, 2025 - 2:55pm
 
Freedom of speech? - R_P - Apr 24, 2025 - 1:00pm
 
Russia - Red_Dragon - Apr 24, 2025 - 9:36am
 
Breaking News - Red_Dragon - Apr 24, 2025 - 8:15am
 
YouTube: Music-Videos - Steely_D - Apr 24, 2025 - 7:28am
 
USA! USA! USA! - R_P - Apr 23, 2025 - 10:00pm
 
Artificial Intelligence - R_P - Apr 23, 2025 - 5:01pm
 
Commercializing Facebook - R_P - Apr 23, 2025 - 2:29pm
 
• • • BRING OUT YOUR DEAD • • •  - Isabeau - Apr 23, 2025 - 2:22pm
 
Business as Usual - R_P - Apr 23, 2025 - 1:05pm
 
Vinyl Only Spin List - Steely_D - Apr 23, 2025 - 9:38am
 
Radio Paradise Staion Break - geoff_morphini - Apr 23, 2025 - 8:16am
 
Geeky funny - Proclivities - Apr 23, 2025 - 7:42am
 
Hockey + Fantasy Hockey - dischuckin - Apr 23, 2025 - 7:13am
 
Things You Thought Today - ScottFromWyoming - Apr 22, 2025 - 9:45pm
 
Real Time with Bill Maher - R_P - Apr 22, 2025 - 1:51pm
 
260,000 Posts in one thread? - Lazy8 - Apr 22, 2025 - 12:27pm
 
Happy Earth Day - R_P - Apr 22, 2025 - 12:26pm
 
Tesla (motors, batteries, etc) - islander - Apr 22, 2025 - 10:03am
 
Thimerosal Vaccines linked to neurological disorders - islander - Apr 21, 2025 - 8:48pm
 
Cryptic Posts - Leave Them Guessing - GeneP59 - Apr 21, 2025 - 8:40am
 
Name My Band - GeneP59 - Apr 20, 2025 - 7:45pm
 
::yesterday:: - Red_Dragon - Apr 20, 2025 - 3:35pm
 
Poetry Forum - oldviolin - Apr 20, 2025 - 8:43am
 
Favourite Scriptures - black321 - Apr 20, 2025 - 8:30am
 
Museum Of Bad Album Covers - Proclivities - Apr 20, 2025 - 7:55am
 
I Thought Earth Had Only One Moon - Red_Dragon - Apr 19, 2025 - 5:06pm
 
The war on funk is over! - R_P - Apr 19, 2025 - 4:02pm
 
Other Medical Stuff - kurtster - Apr 19, 2025 - 1:43pm
 
Quick! I need a chicken... - Isabeau - Apr 19, 2025 - 1:00pm
 
Pernicious Pious Proclivities Particularized Prodigiously - R_P - Apr 19, 2025 - 12:45pm
 
Best Song Comments. - ScottFromWyoming - Apr 19, 2025 - 11:15am
 
Outstanding Covers - oldviolin - Apr 19, 2025 - 9:59am
 
Mars - oldviolin - Apr 19, 2025 - 9:53am
 
Lyrics That Remind You of Someone - oldviolin - Apr 19, 2025 - 9:32am
 
Immigration - R_P - Apr 18, 2025 - 7:05pm
 
Index » Regional/Local » USA/Canada » Republican Party Page: Previous  1, 2, 3, ... 277, 278, 279  Next
Post to this Topic
rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 9, 2025 - 5:24am

 kurtster wrote:

It is not about "free trade" it is about "fair trade".  A world of difference even though the two seem to be conflated in discussions.

I'm looking at the tariffs in two ways.  First it is a negotiation tactic with the goal of reducing or eliminating tariffs on US goods or making them equal to what the importing country imposes on the same or similar items it exports to us.  Second a permanent tariff if that should happen would be much similar to a VAT only the money is collected on the front end rather than on the back end.  Getting it up front eliminates any need for a bureaucracy to administer a VAT program and is much more fair as the costs are included in any downstream activity.  I am against consumption taxes period as they mostly affect the poor and lower level wage earners disproportionately.  Give me a flat tax, too, but that is another story.  

We need to get things priced based upon their actual manufacturing expenses (true costs) without any subsidies or other forms of price manipulation.  Then we can figure out what to do next.  Among other things, making things ourselves keeps money in the country and recirculating to the benefit of the country as a whole.  Buying from outside the country sends our money away and we lose the benefit of recirculation.  The more money we can keep and recirculate internally the more our inherent overall national wealth grows.  Same with energy.  Drill, baby, drill and keep that money at home and from going into the hands of our enemies, making us stronger and them weaker without any military or political pressures involved.


So you couldn't afford the Biden inflation of 3%, but if it means we can level the playing field on 80 years of foreign "abuse" (during which time the US became unimaginably wealthy), you can afford 10% increases on nearly everything?

"I am against consumption taxes period as they mostly affect the poor and lower level wage earners disproportionately",  but tariffs are taxes that are paid by the consumer?  They are regressive taxes.

As for energy...the US has been a net exporter since 2019.  Money is coming into the US, and if you keep increasing production you'll drive down prices and lower your ROI.

Do you ever get tired of justifying Trump's foolishness to yourself?  


NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 9, 2025 - 12:56am

 kurtster wrote:

It is not about "free trade" it is about "fair trade".  A world of difference even though the two seem to be conflated in discussions.

I'm looking at the tariffs in two ways.  First it is a negotiation tactic with the goal of reducing or eliminating tariffs on US goods or making them equal to what the importing country imposes on the same or similar items it exports to us.  Second a permanent tariff if that should happen would be much similar to a VAT only the money is collected on the front end rather than on the back end.  Getting it up front eliminates any need for a bureaucracy to administer a VAT program and is much more fair as the costs are included in any downstream activity.  I am against consumption taxes period as they mostly affect the poor and lower level wage earners disproportionately.  Give me a flat tax, too, but that is another story.  

We need to get things priced based upon their actual manufacturing expenses (true costs) without any subsidies or other forms of price manipulation.  Then we can figure out what to do next.  Among other things, making things ourselves keeps money in the country and recirculating to the benefit of the country as a whole.  Buying from outside the country sends our money away and we lose the benefit of recirculation.  The more money we can keep and recirculate internally the more our inherent overall national wealth grows.  Same with energy.  Drill, baby, drill and keep that money at home and from going into the hands of our enemies, making us stronger and them weaker without any military or political pressures involved.




kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 11:52pm

 black321 wrote:
Believing in the ideal of "free trade" is as naive as believing in the Communist ideal of common ownership.

Back to the current issue...the trump tariffs are making an already bad situation worse...running the economy into the ground while deficits balloon. 

 
It is not about "free trade" it is about "fair trade".  A world of difference even though the two seem to be conflated in discussions.

I'm looking at the tariffs in two ways.  First it is a negotiation tactic with the goal of reducing or eliminating tariffs on US goods or making them equal to what the importing country imposes on the same or similar items it exports to us.  Second a permanent tariff if that should happen would be much similar to a VAT only the money is collected on the front end rather than on the back end.  Getting it up front eliminates any need for a bureaucracy to administer a VAT program and is much more fair as the costs are included in any downstream activity.  I am against consumption taxes period as they mostly affect the poor and lower level wage earners disproportionately.  Give me a flat tax, too, but that is another story.  

We need to get things priced based upon their actual manufacturing expenses (true costs) without any subsidies or other forms of price manipulation.  Then we can figure out what to do next.  Among other things, making things ourselves keeps money in the country and recirculating to the benefit of the country as a whole.  Buying from outside the country sends our money away and we lose the benefit of recirculation.  The more money we can keep and recirculate internally the more our inherent overall national wealth grows.  Same with energy.  Drill, baby, drill and keep that money at home and from going into the hands of our enemies, making us stronger and them weaker without any military or political pressures involved.
NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 9:54pm

 Red_Dragon wrote:


What a couple of idiots; no muzzle awareness at all.




Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar

Location: Gilead


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 6:14pm

 R_P wrote:



What a couple of idiots; no muzzle awareness at all.
R_P

R_P Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 6:02pm


Steely_D

Steely_D Avatar

Location: The foot of Mount Belzoni
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 5:28pm

 Red_Dragon wrote:


Don't forget private money in the electoral process.


Don't talk bad about businesses. Doncha know they're people too!
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar

Location: Gilead


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 3:26pm

 Steely_D wrote:


Not true in general, and a bit of a cop out. Electoral College and gerrymandering put the government in other people's hands. Taking away the input of the majority of the people means you can't blame them for any of this.



Don't forget private money in the electoral process.
Steely_D

Steely_D Avatar

Location: The foot of Mount Belzoni
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 2:30pm

 black321 wrote:


Ultimately, that's it. The people get the gov they deserve. 


Not true in general, and a bit of a cop out. Electoral College and gerrymandering put the government in other people's hands. Taking away the input of the majority of the people means you can't blame them for any of this.

black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 11:41am

 islander wrote:

so could all of the voters



Ultimately, that's it. The people get the gov they deserve. 
islander

islander Avatar

Location: West coast somewhere
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 11:31am

 black321 wrote:


and the democrats propped up Harris after all the bubble wrap (lazy8) fell off biden.
Knowing trump was likely to win the primary, they have themselves to blame.
and no, time has come to stop all the nonsense and for the grown ups to return to the room. 


I'm just not with you on making this the democrats problem. Sure they could have done better, but so could all of the voters. Was biden problematic, sure. Was Harris - Sure. Was it plain to anyone being the slightest bit honest that either was a far better choice for governance - yes.  

The democrats have tried appeasement for years. It doesn't work. Time to let the kids touch the stove. trump is doing exactly as he said he would. The blame all falls on those that voted for him regardless if they believed him or not. I voted for an adult, the slimmest of margins (0.015%) would have swung this the other way. There is no mandate. Our electoral system is as botched as our political one. Kurtster actually does have a point that we need some major institutional restructuring. But there are ways to do it without harming people. Sure, get some grown ups in there. I'm not sure what method you are going to use, but I'm for that.  But the method we have for 'putting people in the room' is elections. And right now a lot of people are voting for people who are not serious about governing. Until that changes, not much else will. 


black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 10:19am

 islander wrote:


No, it's not in anyone's best interest. But we have protected people from the consequences of their actions for a long time and they have come to think it doesn't matter. Trump shouldn't have been allowed to run, but congress refused to do it's job. People think it's fine to vote for a bomb thrower because they think they will be insulated from the bombs and they like the noise. So let them feel some of the pain and they may realize that bombs are not good. Not sure how else to get through to them. People who say 'keep your government out of my medicare' need some life lessons. Unfortunately it appears we may all have to suffer with it.


and the democrats propped up Harris after all the bubble wrap (lazy8) fell off biden.
Knowing trump was likely to win the primary, they have themselves to blame.
and no, time has come to stop all the nonsense and for the grown ups to return to the room. 
NoEnzLefttoSplit

NoEnzLefttoSplit Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 10:11am

104%
islander

islander Avatar

Location: West coast somewhere
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 10:03am

 black321 wrote:


Given what they are doing...that doesnt seem likely
and is it in the country's best interest for the democrats to sit this one out, especially since they contributed to getting us to where we are now (up until Jan 2025)?
Of course I prefer where things were pre-trump...but there were still mounting issues. 


No, it's not in anyone's best interest. But we have protected people from the consequences of their actions for a long time and they have come to think it doesn't matter. Trump shouldn't have been allowed to run, but congress refused to do it's job. People think it's fine to vote for a bomb thrower because they think they will be insulated from the bombs and they like the noise. So let them feel some of the pain and they may realize that bombs are not good. Not sure how else to get through to them. People who say 'keep your government out of my medicare' need some life lessons. Unfortunately it appears we may all have to suffer with it.
marko86

marko86 Avatar

Location: North TX
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 10:00am

The way I figure it, is when Republicans start fearing their own constituents more then Trump then maybe they will start trying to stop the madness. They are not there yet, but some small signs are there. Maybe when they figure out how heavily armed some of them are.....
black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 9:51am

 islander wrote:

The democrats have spent decades capitulating and enabling the bad behavior of the republicans. The republicans are now in control. They have the majorities, they have the guy in the big seat. They were told, repeatedly, that this would be the result of their actions. This is up to them to go fix.



Given what they are doing...that doesnt seem likely
and is it in the country's best interest for the democrats to sit this one out, especially since they contributed to getting us to where we are now (up until Jan 2025)?
Of course I prefer where things were pre-trump...but there were still mounting issues. 
islander

islander Avatar

Location: West coast somewhere
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 9:48am

 black321 wrote:

Believing in the ideal of "free trade" is as naive as believing in the Communist ideal of common ownership.
As long as the main goal of our trade policies is maximizing corp profit, they are doomed to fail society. 

Back to the current issue...the trump tariffs are making an already bad situation worse...running the economy into the ground while deficits balloon. 
Republicans appear to be providing tacit support,
and the democrats messaging of "tariffs are bad" is not enough...as they appear to be sitting back and letting the shit show unravel, which is not helping its constituents one bit.
What is the answer to our trade imbalances and other issues, eg, sourcing/manufacturing of key goods like pharmaceuticals...


The democrats have spent decades capitulating and enabling the bad behavior of the republicans. The republicans are now in control. They have the majorities, they have the guy in the big seat. They were told, repeatedly, that this would be the result of their actions. This is up to them to go fix.


black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 9:46am

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:

Well a robust FDA with a clear mission to ensure safe and effective medicines would be pretty swell.



No doubt, and part of the problem with drug shortages is that the FDA post covid inspections are way behind as they prioritize foreign factories. 
islander

islander Avatar

Location: West coast somewhere
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 9:45am

 Lazy8 wrote:

Trump I's tarrifs (and trade policies in general) were bad. They started the undoing of decades of work by people who actually knew what they were doing to reduce trade barriers around the world. And more generally, by breaking those agreements, damaged the trust anyone could have had in any agreement we ever make, on any subject. His second term, by doubling down on that strategy, has absolutely wrecked the world's confidence in our ability to keep a promise. But I digress.

Trump's first term trade policies provoked retaliation against US agricultural products. This was felt so deeply and immediately that the Trump administration created additonal farm subsidies to offset that impact. We raised prices on ourselves and provoked a boycott on our goods, then borrowed more money to pay off the constituency that was most immediately affected.

I'm not looking for intellectual consistency, that's not going to happen in American politics. The incumbent parties are not driven by political philosophy or principles, they are coalitions of interests and grievances that are driven by expediency and appeasement. I'm looking for adults to enter the room and rein in the toddlers. And despairing.

WWGJD*? He first and foremost would recognize that the executive branch has constitutional restraints that need to be respected. One of the many problems of our democracy is that the legislative branch has ceded too much power to the executive. That's a problem one man, in one election, cannot fix. With that power we now have ample evidence that the problem is not symmetrical: one man in one election can make it much, much worse.

*What Would Gary Johnson Do



Good.

ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Apr 8, 2025 - 9:39am

 black321 wrote:


What is the answer to ...other issues, eg, sourcing/manufacturing of key goods like pharmaceuticals...


Well a robust FDA with a clear mission to ensure safe and effective medicines would be pretty swell.

Page: Previous  1, 2, 3, ... 277, 278, 279  Next