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ColdMiser

ColdMiser Avatar

Location: On the Trail
Gender: Male


Posted: May 10, 2022 - 12:33pm

 rgio wrote:

.  They don't appreciate that they are a drag on earnings, and instead see poor, black, urban unwed mothers as the recipients of aid payments... which explains their disdain for the programs they underfund and overuse.


Amazing the lasting influence of Reagan's infamous Welfare Queen rhetoric isn't it?

rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: May 10, 2022 - 12:27pm

 kurtster wrote:

I asked the question.  Mine was not rhetorical while yours is.

It's not rhetorical.  If you are going to assign the protections of a living child, don't you have to provide benefits to the child and their family?  


kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: May 10, 2022 - 12:03pm

 rgio wrote:
 

Are you giving personal exemptions to the parents of the unborn, and child tax credits upon conception?  Increases in food stamps?  Free access to childhood healthcare programs?
 
I asked the question.  Mine was not rhetorical while yours is.
rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: May 10, 2022 - 10:49am

 kurtster wrote:

Exactly !!

I have no dog in this hunt either.  Just putting it to those who do.

Are you giving personal exemptions to the parents of the unborn, and child tax credits upon conception?  Increases in food stamps?  Free access to childhood healthcare programs?


Proclivities

Proclivities Avatar

Location: Paris of the Piedmont
Gender: Male


Posted: May 10, 2022 - 10:47am

 black321 wrote:


Maybe they just resent their own neighbors. 

Good point, a lot of people do resent their neighbors - for all sorts of reasons.

kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: May 10, 2022 - 10:45am

 black321 wrote:
  There is the real biological argument of, "When does human life start, and deserve legal rights/consideration?"

But I don't think either side is interested, 

and I'm not smart enough to comment (or I'm smart enough not to comment)...so I will waddle away from this discussion. 
 
Exactly !!

I have no dog in this hunt either.  Just putting it to those who do.
black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: May 10, 2022 - 10:35am

 kurtster wrote:

Well since you put it that way ...

Riddle me this ...

How come if you would say, shoot a pregnant woman and kill the fetus, regardless of whether or not the woman survives, you get charged with murder of the fetus.

But a woman can kill or abort the fetus herself and it's no big deal.

How is that since a fetus is not considered a person yet ?


There is the real biological argument of, "When does human life start, and deserve legal rights/consideration?"
But I don't think either side is interested, 
and I'm not smart enough to comment (or I'm smart enough not to comment)...so I will waddle away from this discussion. 

kurtster

kurtster Avatar

Location: where fear is not a virtue
Gender: Male


Posted: May 10, 2022 - 10:26am

 islander wrote:
 Isabeau wrote:
11 States Currently have Trigger Laws to ban abortion without ANY Exceptions for Rape or Incest. Do not believe the Sunday Republican talking heads implying that they will get those exemptions added. They aren't going to: Hardcore Republicans are saying absolutely No exceptions for Rape or Incest.  Nervous Physicians have expressed they will not feel comfortable performing needed D&C's for women who have miscarried or addressing ectopic pregnancies, due to fear of litigation.   Women will die ... in the name of 'pro-life.'
It's not just the 11 states. They are laying the groundwork to declare a fetus as a person. They will then have a federal ban overruling other states.  Is it hypocrisy?  Are you surprised?
 
Well since you put it that way ...

Riddle me this ...

How come if you would say, shoot a pregnant woman and kill the fetus, regardless of whether or not the woman survives, you get charged with murder of the fetus.

But a woman can kill or abort the fetus herself and it's no big deal.

How is that since a fetus is not considered a person yet ?
black321

black321 Avatar

Location: An earth without maps
Gender: Male


Posted: May 10, 2022 - 9:53am

 Proclivities wrote:

Yeah, I knew that was your point essentially; I got to it in my last sentence.  Some of those states also have the highest per capita numbers of welfare (SNAP) recipients, though those numbers jump around for different factors and times.  But there is an irony to the disdain for the Federal govt coming from some people who depend on it so largely.


Maybe they just resent their own neighbors. 
Proclivities

Proclivities Avatar

Location: Paris of the Piedmont
Gender: Male


Posted: May 10, 2022 - 9:47am

 rgio wrote:

A lot of this isn't about politics.  Education (until recently) wasn't really about politics, so much as priorities.   The FEMA needs are due to natural disasters...hurricanes, tornados, and fires (which is why CA makes the list).  The point is...they hate government, especially the federal one, but then rely on it more than most. They are net takers, and still complain that the government gives away too much money.  They don't appreciate that they are a drag on earnings, and instead see poor, black, urban unwed mothers as the recipients of aid payments... which explains their disdain for the programs they underfund and overuse.


Yeah, I knew that was your point essentially; I got to it in my last sentence.  Some of those states also have the highest per capita numbers of welfare (SNAP) recipients, though those numbers jump around for different factors and times.  But there is an irony to the disdain for the Federal govt coming from some people who depend on it so largely.
rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: May 10, 2022 - 9:39am

 Proclivities wrote:

To be fair, FEMA allotments are determined primarily by natural disasters - or projected natural disasters - not political affiliations.  However many of the outspoken critics of FEMA are from states which often need it most.


A lot of this isn't about politics.  Education (until recently) wasn't really about politics, so much as priorities.   The FEMA needs are due to natural disasters...hurricanes, tornados, and fires (which is why CA makes the list).  The point is...they hate government, especially the federal one, but then rely on it more than most. They are net takers, and still complain that the government gives away too much money.  They don't appreciate that they are a drag on earnings, and instead see poor, black, urban unwed mothers as the recipients of aid payments... which explains their disdain for the programs they underfund and overuse.

Proclivities

Proclivities Avatar

Location: Paris of the Piedmont
Gender: Male


Posted: May 10, 2022 - 9:30am

 rgio wrote:

What's truly amazing about these states (to generalize...not all of them hit all of the following targets)..

...
Depend on FEMA when things get tough
...


To be fair, FEMA allotments are determined primarily by natural disasters - or projected natural disasters - not political affiliations.  However many of the outspoken critics of FEMA are from states which often need it most.

Steely_D

Steely_D Avatar

Location: Biscayne Bay
Gender: Male


Posted: May 9, 2022 - 5:56pm

 rgio wrote:

What's truly amazing about these states 


Yeah, to be fair: why are the other states trying so hard? After all, the USSR doesn't exist any more. It might be fine for the USA to change.
rgio

rgio Avatar

Location: West Jersey
Gender: Male


Posted: May 9, 2022 - 2:52pm

 Steely_D wrote:


The Republican Party has morphed over time to be little more than hypocrites, racists, and thieves. They have no political platform, and are just a contemporary version of the southern slaveholders that tried, and failed, to secede from the USA.
Which makes me think that, rather than fight about it, we let them secede. They get WY, TX, LA, FL, OK, TN, northern CA/southern OR (the "state of Jefferson") and maybe South Carolina and Alabama. Good luck to you all. Meanwhile, the rest of the nation gets to keep on keeping on with putting up with that racist, misogynist mindset.


What's truly amazing about these states (to generalize...not all of them hit all of the following targets)..

They take more than they give to the federal government.

They are the least educated

They have higher representation in national elections and the senate (per person)

Have higher opiod use,

Canceled medicare expansion in their states which lead to huge Obamacare enrollment,

Depend on FEMA when things get tough

Have the highest incarceration rates

Have the highest murder rates

And yet are the least happy places to live.

I'm with ya'... don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out.


Isabeau

Isabeau Avatar

Location: sou' tex
Gender: Female


Posted: May 9, 2022 - 2:10pm

 Red_Dragon wrote:


Will the new Republicanless nation fund relocation for the expats in the states mentioned?


Not when selling the home you own now won't buy another one in any state ...
Red_Dragon

Red_Dragon Avatar



Posted: May 9, 2022 - 1:45pm

 Steely_D wrote:

Wear a mask because of science? "My body my choice!"
but Roe v Wade? "Uh, no. We're gonna tell you what to do because religion."

The Republican Party has morphed over time to be little more than hypocrites, racists, and thieves. They have no political platform, and are just a contemporary version of the southern slaveholders that tried, and failed, to secede from the USA.
Which makes me think that, rather than fight about it, we let them secede. They get WY, TX, LA, FL, OK, TN, northern CA/southern OR (the "state of Jefferson") and maybe South Carolina and Alabama. Good luck to you all. Meanwhile, the rest of the nation gets to keep on keeping on with putting up with that racist, misogynist mindset.



Will the new Republicanless nation fund relocation for the expats in the states mentioned?
kcar

kcar Avatar



Posted: May 9, 2022 - 1:30pm

 Steely_D wrote:

Wear a mask because of science? "My body my choice!"
but Roe v Wade? "Uh, no. We're gonna tell you what to do because religion."

The Republican Party has morphed over time to be little more than hypocrites, racists, and thieves. They have no political platform, and are just a contemporary version of the southern slaveholders that tried, and failed, to secede from the USA.
Which makes me think that, rather than fight about it, we let them secede. They get WY, TX, LA, FL, OK, TN, northern CA/southern OR (the "state of Jefferson") and maybe South Carolina and Alabama. Good luck to you all. Meanwhile, the rest of the nation gets to keep on keeping on with putting up with that racist, misogynist mindset.




Thank you!

Isabeau

Isabeau Avatar

Location: sou' tex
Gender: Female


Posted: May 9, 2022 - 1:10pm

 Steely_D wrote:

Wear a mask because of science? "My body my choice!"
but Roe v Wade? "Uh, no. We're gonna tell you what to do because religion."

The Republican Party has morphed over time to be little more than hypocrites, racists, and thieves. They have no political platform, and are just a contemporary version of the southern slaveholders that tried, and failed, to secede from the USA.
Which makes me think that, rather than fight about it, we let them secede. They get WY, TX, LA, FL, OK, TN, northern CA/southern OR (the "state of Jefferson") and maybe South Carolina and Alabama. Good luck to you all. Meanwhile, the rest of the nation gets to keep on keeping on with putting up with that racist, misogynist mindset.



Government regulating any American's Internal Organs is the very definition of Unlawful Search and Seizure.


Steely_D

Steely_D Avatar

Location: Biscayne Bay
Gender: Male


Posted: May 9, 2022 - 1:06pm

Wear a mask because of science? "My body my choice!"
but Roe v Wade? "Uh, no. We're gonna tell you what to do because religion."

The Republican Party has morphed over time to be little more than hypocrites, racists, and thieves. They have no political platform, and are just a contemporary version of the southern slaveholders that tried, and failed, to secede from the USA.
Which makes me think that, rather than fight about it, we let them secede. They get WY, TX, LA, FL, OK, TN, northern CA/southern OR (the "state of Jefferson") and maybe South Carolina and Alabama. Good luck to you all. Meanwhile, the rest of the nation gets to keep on keeping on without putting up with that racist, misogynist mindset.

Isabeau

Isabeau Avatar

Location: sou' tex
Gender: Female


Posted: May 9, 2022 - 12:20pm

 islander wrote:


It's not just the 11 states. They are laying the groundwork to declare a fetus as a person. They will then have a federal ban overruling other states.  Is it hypocrisy?  Are you surprised?

Surprised at the viciousness with which this demented party has come to utterly hate women. 

Personhood for a fetus should therefore include:
1. SS#
2. Immediate child support by DNA proven Baby Daddy
3. Two votes at the ballot box
4. An 'Assistant Driver's License'
5. Child Tax credit (from day of conception)

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