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New Order — Ceremony
Album: Substance
Avg rating:
7.5

Your rating:
Total ratings: 1379









Released: 1987
Length: 4:18
Plays (last 30 days): 1
This is why events unnerve me
They find it all a different story
No concern, for wheels are turning
Turn again and turn towards this time
All she asks the strength to hold me
Then again the same old story
Word will travel oh so quickly
Travel first and lean towards this time

Oh, I'll break them down, no mercy shown
''(in the original New Order version: "I'll break them all ...")''
Heaven knows, it's got to be this time
Watching her, these things she said
The times she cried, too frail to wake this time

Oh, I'll break them down, no mercy shown
Heaven knows, it's got to be this time
Avenues all lined with trees
Picture me and then you start watching
Watching forever
Forever, watching love grow
Forever, letting me go
Forever
Comments (218)add comment
 tomcool wrote:


WHFS forever!
 
(1) Catch Weasel on WTMD (2) wonder why WHFS is on here see: feastyourearsthefilm.com
Here's to 1987. This was on the radio alot that year. Liked it then, love it now.
Saw them in Tampa, FL many years ago and I thought they were excellent as did the rest of the crowd.  Can't immediate figure out what year though...
Seen them at the Amsterdam show October 2019 : very good show !
Merci ! Toute ma jeunesse
Ah man, WHFS in Washington DC playing this back in the day. Thanks Bill!
Why are all the postings from years ago? 
 thewiseking wrote:
Since we are on to the New Order Live subject, I can vouch, as one who worked backstage in order to get into an NYC show back in '86, that this is indeed a studio band. They sucked and the New York Crowd (now a thing of the past) booed them for it. 
Nowadays they all woulda updated their status posting how great it all was and given em a couple standing ovations. 

 

 
Although I recall Joy Division sounded very good when I saw them at Uni back in the day. Also New Order were fine at Rock City (Nottingham) a year or so later. So perhaps this is an indoor vs outdoor thing?
Since we are on to the New Order Live subject, I can vouch, as one who worked backstage in order to get into an NYC show back in '86, that this is indeed a studio band. They sucked and the New York Crowd (now a thing of the past) booed them for it. 
Nowadays they all woulda updated their status posting how great it all was and given em a couple standing ovations. 



 
 BillG wrote:

...

I've also heard sound at outdoor venues with excellent gear that totally sucked. A number of shows at Shoreline Amphitheater come to mind — including New Order, who were pretty much unlistenable there too. Maybe they take their own near-deaf mixer on tour with them. Lots of artists do...

 
Indeed. And in New Order's case, though I love them dearly, they really do benefit heavily from recording in the studio. I bought their live BBC disc, and Barney was so out of tune through the whole show it was embarrassing to listen to. Bad mixing may have been a mercy. 
Made an instant 10 for me. Tremendous sound!
Perhaps it's the gnashing, edgy guitars, reminiscent of something by Gang of Four, maybe...but anyway, the damn thing is ELECTRIC!
I love this version
 trevc wrote:
Is the guy singing from a nearby toilet? Man this is bad.

 

Is the guy singing from a nearby toilet? Man this is bad.
Wow. Have a listen to Courtney Barnett song "Depreston". I don't know if New Order should be flattered or angry, but money should be involved...
 Ag3nt0rang3 wrote:

For what it's worth, in my limited time mixing bands in high school and several kinds of performance as a volunteer in the local community theatre, mixing outside is hard, man. There are essentially no acoustics to speak of; the sound bounces off the ground and goes away forever, unless there are hills or valleys nearby to reflect everything back at you out of phase. You get frequencies at one end of the range getting absorbed by the first few rows of bodies and the rest travelling on and on and on. If you're in the back, forget about it, you're just going to hear a tinny garbled mess, and there's not much the mixer can do to compensate for that.

Edit: You can compensate with multiple banks of speakers set back from the stage, keep the overall volume low, but then you have to make sure that each bank is synced so that the signals from the stage all get played at the "same time" (actually you have to lag the speakers further out slightly to account for the travel time of the sound waves) and you need great gear for that, and a really smart tech running it. Tricky.

 
Nice post.  For a number of years, I was associated with an outdoor festival in California (Strawberry) that had a fabulous mixing crew. They used stacks midway back that were timed perfectly (that part is just math, really) & delivered a mix that was like being inside a giant pair of headphones, pretty much anywhere in the crowd. So it *can* be done, but it takes great gear & excellent ears. Like you noted, it probably also works a lot better at moderate volume levels (this was a mostly-acoustic festival). 

I've also heard sound at outdoor venues with excellent gear that totally sucked. A number of shows at Shoreline Amphitheater come to mind — including New Order, who were pretty much unlistenable there too. Maybe they take their own near-deaf mixer on tour with them. Lots of artists do...
 SquiddlyDiddly wrote:
We went to a festival a few years ago and New Order were headlining. The main stage was a large tent in a field and the acoustics were so bad it was actually impossible to stay inside for longer than a few mins. Seriously, it was like standing in front of a light show playing white noise. 

We tried standing outside, which helped a bit, but not much, but it was raining. We spent the rest of that evening in our van hearing the set (including this track I think) as a faint hum in the distance. 

Why is it that so many festival/gig sound engineers don't have ears that work? It is not acceptable to just turn up everything to 11, it is more important to actually be a sound engineer and not sit there and try to look cool.

/rant 

 
For what it's worth, in my limited time mixing bands in high school and several kinds of performance as a volunteer in the local community theatre, mixing outside is hard, man. There are essentially no acoustics to speak of; the sound bounces off the ground and goes away forever, unless there are hills or valleys nearby to reflect everything back at you out of phase. You get frequencies at one end of the range getting absorbed by the first few rows of bodies and the rest travelling on and on and on. If you're in the back, forget about it, you're just going to hear a tinny garbled mess, and there's not much the mixer can do to compensate for that.

Edit: You can compensate with multiple banks of speakers set back from the stage, keep the overall volume low, but then you have to make sure that each bank is synced so that the signals from the stage all get played at the "same time" (actually you have to lag the speakers further out slightly to account for the travel time of the sound waves) and you need great gear for that, and a really smart tech running it. Tricky.
Saw them on Late Night with Colbert the other night...they still rock with verve and purpose! and there is something amazing about this
Wow I just got New Order, serious epiphany; I think I finally just stopped being angry at them for not being Joy Division. Only took me 35 years...
If you like this, I think it was on a sondtrack for Marie Antoinette - whole. Album was great and had a lot of songs similar to this one.
 kingart wrote:
Good dynamic tune. The vocals, though, must have been recorded in the basement and sent up the heating ducts.  

 
Good one man!  : )
new to me, glad I didn't miss it
 le_colonel wrote:
9->10

probably one of the greatest songs of all time

how did I ever give it only 9 

 
Ha ha,  I had exact same reaction.
Good dynamic tune. The vocals, though, must have been recorded in the basement and sent up the heating ducts.  
Nice choice for New Order.
 On_The_Beach wrote:
Re Poacher's comments below: I agree completely. It's 2015; there is no excuse for bad sound. The technology is readily available. It comes down to bands and/or their management simply not wanting to spend the time and money to get the sound right. "Those suckers are still gonna show up and pay 150 bucks a ticket anyway. Screw 'em." I saw Roger Waters and Paul McCartney (separate shows) play a 60,000-seat football stadium and the sound was perfect in both cases. It can be done! And sadly I have seen bands in smaller venues where you literally couldn't tell what song they were playing, the sound was so bad.

 

These guys have always been weird this way. This song itself is an example of that; the only extant recording (that I know of) of Joy Division doing this song is a fragment with the vocals buried in the mix for half of it. They started off rough live and never got that much better. The one live disc of New Order's that I bought was flat-out (pun definitely intended) embarrassing, Sumner couldn't find a note to save his life, and the mixing seemed like an afterthought.

But man, the songs are so very great. 
Wow, thanks for the boost to my morning!
Re Poacher's comments below: I agree completely. It's 2015; there is no excuse for bad sound. The technology is readily available. It comes down to bands and/or their management simply not wanting to spend the time and money to get the sound right. "Those suckers are still gonna show up and pay 150 bucks a ticket anyway. Screw 'em." I saw Roger Waters and Paul McCartney (separate shows) play a 60,000-seat football stadium and the sound was perfect in both cases. It can be done! And sadly I have seen bands in smaller venues where you literally couldn't tell what song they were playing, the sound was so bad.
We went to a festival a few years ago and New Order were headlining. The main stage was a large tent in a field and the acoustics were so bad it was actually impossible to stay inside for longer than a few mins. Seriously, it was like standing in front of a light show playing white noise. 

We tried standing outside, which helped a bit, but not much, but it was raining. We spent the rest of that evening in our van hearing the set (including this track I think) as a faint hum in the distance. 

Why is it that so many festival/gig sound engineers don't have ears that work? It is not acceptable to just turn up everything to 11, it is more important to actually be a sound engineer and not sit there and try to look cool.

/rant 
If one were to damage or deface the cover or contents of this record album could that be considered Substance Abuse?
simple ... profound ... enduring
Everythings gone green...
 
I do not hear so much difference to some modern bands...
 rdo wrote:

IF YOU DO NOT LIKE THIS THEN PLEASE JUSTIFY YOUR EXISTENCE



 
My wife loves them, and I love my wife.
 Chingachgook wrote:
When you consider the musical mediocrity around at the time (the unappetising 80s), New Order just oozed sophistication and taste.

 
Well, they oozed something....
 Biscobret wrote:
What a great fucking song - from a great fucking band.  This transitional period from Joy Division —> New Order was simply amazing.  The artistic touch of JD, without so much gloom — but not yet as happy-dappy as later NO — just perfect.

 
I even like the happy dappy stuff.
 le_colonel wrote:
9->10

probably one of the greatest songs of all time

how did I ever give it only 9 

 
I like it!
9->10

probably one of the greatest songs of all time

how did I ever give it only 9 
 rdo wrote:

IF YOU DO NOT LIKE THIS THEN PLEASE JUSTIFY YOUR EXISTENCE



 
I make a nice quiche.......
 el-pezos wrote:

Good to hear on RP, beats U2 any day...



 
..... it most certainly does :))

Good to hear on RP, beats U2 any day...


Legendary... this is music!{#Drummer}
New Order - an acquired taste I never remember acquiring but your hand doesn't automatically search for the volume for no reason.  Great tune.
10
1
 Biscobret wrote:
What a great fucking song - from a great fucking band.  This transitional period from Joy Division --> New Order was simply amazing.  The artistic touch of JD, without so much gloom -- but not yet as happy-dappy as later NO -- just perfect.

 
{#Yes}{#Yes}  …totally agree.
9
I had the privilege of seeing them live in the summer 87 in Århus, Denmark... their live sound was raw and Hooks bass ripping... good times


We were mother-fucking Joy Division -- what're YOU looking at?!?!?!?!?
What a great fucking song - from a great fucking band.  This transitional period from Joy Division --> New Order was simply amazing.  The artistic touch of JD, without so much gloom -- but not yet as happy-dappy as later NO -- just perfect.
it was quite a while ago chingachook, I was young, and have in these past years lost several good friends.  It can actually start to get scary when you put things in perspective... those nights in the 80's were for us kids doing clubs and fucking opening up to this new sound, a different sound.  To hear it again is a joy!  Please find some way, some powerful way, to open up to Life right now! Joy Division is a strong reminder, in my mind, of a 20 something for once seeing, hearing and caressing this life!  We get one chance
 Donna_Stride wrote:

One of the perfect songs from all the many years I have loved music.

Definitely a song performed by Joy Division and I am sure they played it when I saw them live.   



 
This ^^^^^

Yes Joy Division did play it live, in fact there is a live version of them playing it on the Still album.

Like many of the early New Order tracks this was essentially a Joy Division track recorded under the guise of New Order owing to the untimely death of Ian Curtis.
song is an 11, and another example of why Bill is so f'ing brilliant as a DJ -- The Dead --> classic New Order ?!?!?!?!  Who Else does this?

LOVE LOVE LOVE RP !!!!!!

 Chingachgook wrote:
When you consider the musical mediocrity around at the time (the unappetising 80s), New Order just oozed sophistication and taste.

 
There was/is musical mediocrity in every decade - the 1980s did not significantly exceed any other decade in that respect - it was just more visible thanks to MTV and that sentiment still exists thanks to the "Classic Rock" mentality.  Sophistication and taste are rarely prerequisites for making rock 'n' roll but New Order was pretty fun.

One of the perfect songs from all the many years I have loved music.

Definitely a song performed by Joy Division and I am sure they played it when I saw them live.   


When you consider the musical mediocrity around at the time (the unappetising 80s), New Order just oozed sophistication and taste.
 :+:_DL wrote:
I hate this band not so much for their mediocre noise, but for opening the doors for so many untalented whiners who shamelessly mimic them.   
I don't care what anybody says, New Order sucks. IMHO {#Angel}

 
Hmmm, that makes as much sense as me declaring I hate the English language because it enables you to write such drivel. {#Wink}
I hate this band not so much for their mediocre noise, but for opening the doors for so many untalented whiners who shamelessly mimic them.   
I don't care what anybody says, New Order sucks. IMHO {#Angel}
 DaMoGan wrote:

Do you feel old? Wait, before you answer...

New Order, circa 2007

Now, do you feel old?


 
You bastard.
 rdo wrote:

IF YOU DO NOT LIKE THIS THEN PLEASE JUSTIFY YOUR EXISTENCE



 
TO YOU?
it sounds good mixing a little of this kind of stuff in with the other stuff----
 rdo wrote:

IF YOU DO NOT LIKE THIS THEN PLEASE JUSTIFY YOUR EXISTENCE



 

To give you someone to feel superior to?
 KurtfromLaQuinta wrote:
Better than an enema.
 

I would run with an enigma...  love this song...

IF YOU DO NOT LIKE THIS THEN PLEASE JUSTIFY YOUR EXISTENCE


One of my favourite tracks ever.
It's up there with "Teenage Kicks" (Undertones) and "Say What You Want" (Texas) as 'perfectly' constructed songs. I'm not a musician, so I can't really explain what I mean, other than I could listen to them again and again. While I'm list building, there's also "Tempted" (Squeeze) and "Don't Stop Believin'" (Journey) to go on the perfect songs list.

Any other fans of Ceremony might be interested to know that Radiohead did a very listenable cover of the song (and I hate covers). You can find it on YouTube.

Lastly, there's plenty of discussion elsewhere on whether this track was officially a Joy Division track or a New Order track. I think it's a Joy Division song first released on a New Order album, but written and first performed by Joy Division. The lyrics are Ian Curtis' and a live version can be found on Joy Divisions' "Still" album with Ian on vocal of course.

I grew up in the north of England in the '70s and regret never having seen Joy Division live during those days.
Did see plenty of other good bands though...   :-)
Pink Floyd and Hawkwind played my school hall. Who else can say that?

Do you feel old? Wait, before you answer...

New Order, circa 2007

Now, do you feel old?

Adds substance to the day -


Very supremely mediocre.
freakin good song would definetely like to listen to it more often
 Ag3nt0rang3 wrote:

Thanks for this; I've been meaning to dredge up the lyrics to this song for a long time now.
 



 peacockangel wrote:
This is why events unnerve me,
They find it all, a different story,
Notice whom for wheels are turning,
Turn again and turn towards this time,
All she ask's the strength to hold me,
Then again the same old story,
World will travel, oh so quickly,
Travel first and lean towards this time. Oh, I'll break them down, no mercy shown,
Heaven knows, it's got to be this time,
Watching her, these things she said,
The times she cried,
Too frail to wake this time. Oh I'll break them down, no mercy shown
Heaven knows, it's got to be this time,
Avenues all lined with trees,
Picture me and then you start watching,
Watching forever, forever,
Watching love grow, forever,
Letting me know, forever.

 

..thx indeed!..first NO single, released in 1981..reflects more of the darkness of their Joy Division origins..
Pretty insubstantial....  1.
 hayduke2 wrote:
Quality vibes and abit of New Order removes gray hairs!
Hoka hey Bobert, you have more spectacular nights in your canyons than you'll find in alphabet town these recent years, a weakened pulse
 
Never the same after Giuliani - I much preferred the edge of the 70's and 80's. Damn.

( btw - I met Seldom Seen. Unfortunately Hayduke (the Abbey Hayduke) is no longer with us. HD2 roams the east end, it seems. )
 Cynaera wrote:
I think what caught me first about this song was the drums - very Mick Fleetwood-ish. Heavy-handed, but in a good way; they offset the bass quite effectively.  I like this music. {#Music}
 
Miss you so much, Ann...

rest in peace... 
Quality vibes and abit of New Order removes gray hairs!
Hoka hey Bobert, you have more spectacular nights in your canyons than you'll find in alphabet town these recent years, a weakened pulse
 hayduke2 wrote:
memories of being skinny, my hair sheared off by my nubile teen lover, pulsing drums, throbbing lights, just moving to this like a bopping tribe, the sound and the action of young life, for the whole dark night, a dark pulsing room of us
 
Seemed like a dark pulsing city, back then... 
Still have my 12 inch single from Tower Records on Broadway. God I am feeling old!
Wow, that brought back some memories.   I am going to have to dig out that CD when I get home and play the whole thing.
Nice contrast with the preceding song—The Dead's "Not Fade Away/Going Down the Road Feeling Bad." Couldn't listen to many consecutive songs of either band, but back to back they're a nice change from the other style. 
 rtrudeau wrote:
Why do the vocals sound like they were recorded on a dimestore mic? It kind of ruins the song for me. 
 
Beats the hell out of the vocal line on the incomplete live recording of this song by Joy Division (which as far as I know is the only recording of this song with Ian Curtis on vocals). The Sound tech had the vocals buried for most of the song. Damn shame.
Wow, what a surprise. I never hear New Order on RP. I love their early stuff (like this) especially.

Thanks for playing it. 
Why do the vocals sound like they were recorded on a dimestore mic? It kind of ruins the song for me. 
memories of being skinny, my hair sheared off by my nubile teen lover, pulsing drums, throbbing lights, just moving to this like a bopping tribe, the sound and the action of young life, for the whole dark night, a dark pulsing room of us
Yaaaay - an all-time fav. Love love love it. Brings me back to the East Village in the 80's. 
 romeotuma wrote:

Oh yes we do, metaphorically...  and this song squeezes mine...  I can feel it!



 
Better than an enema.

Right here right now, one of the best things they ever did, kills me every time.
No misplacing that guitar....Love New Order/Joy Division
timeless classic
beautifully raw{#Bananajam} 
I think what caught me first about this song was the drums - very Mick Fleetwood-ish. Heavy-handed, but in a good way; they offset the bass quite effectively.  I like this music. {#Music}
 peacockangel wrote:
This is why events unnerve me,
They find it all, a different story,
Notice whom for wheels are turning,
Turn again and turn towards this time,
All she ask's the strength to hold me,
Then again the same old story,
World will travel, oh so quickly,
Travel first and lean towards this time. Oh, I'll break them down, no mercy shown,
Heaven knows, it's got to be this time,
Watching her, these things she said,
The times she cried,
Too frail to wake this time. Oh I'll break them down, no mercy shown
Heaven knows, it's got to be this time,
Avenues all lined with trees,
Picture me and then you start watching,
Watching forever, forever,
Watching love grow, forever,
Letting me know, forever.
 
Thanks for this; I've been meaning to dredge up the lyrics to this song for a long time now.
 a_genuine_find wrote:


{#Stupid} Humans don't have gizzards {#Wave}
 


Oh yes we do, metaphorically...  and this song squeezes mine...  I can feel it!



Love it completely no questions
nice. brings back a lot of memories.
 romeotuma wrote:


This song squeezes my gizzards...  love it...

 
 

{#Stupid} Humans don't have gizzards {#Wave}
 Biscobret wrote:
Early New Order & Joy Division made some perfect music.
 
Try Bad Lieutenant. It's Sumner and Cunningham. You might like "Never cry another tear"


A great song  and a great 80's album.  I still have this album in shuffle rotation for listening.
Simply Awesome {#Mrgreen}
Early New Order & Joy Division made some perfect music.
Perfect 10.
 jademon wrote:
Brilliant.  Interpol is certainly channeling this era of New Order, but their music is unique and beautiful in its own right.
 
Whoa!  Good call — I somehow never noticed that before, but it's definitely there with this song (and Interpol's "Rest My Chemistry" comes to mind).


A brilliant sparse work that would supply New Order with instead street cred before they would go on and mess up in later years.


This song squeezes my gizzards...  love it...

 
 Stingray wrote:
Certainly not their album with the biggest SUBSTANCE!

Still - NEW ORDER is a great band.
This song means nothing to me, though!
NOTHING AT ALL!
 
{#Clap} Well, good for you.


Brings back great memories for me.

Driving at night in my friends car at 17. Their 'last' gig at Reading in 1989 etc etc..
I never related to new order.  sorry=4.
Certainly not their album with the biggest SUBSTANCE!

Still - NEW ORDER is a great band.
This song means nothing to me, though!
NOTHING AT ALL!


We be dancing...  love it...

 
Thanks for playing New Order — Blue Monday would be a welcome addition to the playlist some time soon as well!
Deceptively simple guitar work here.  Playing against the grain of pop/rock is much more difficult than it seems.  The awkward timing changes and interplay between the bass and guitars have a falling off the roof quality that perfectly matches the lyrics.

sounds like canned ,,,something,#3
NEW ORDER IS 7-8
This song is "1"
New
New Order by ~idlm
©2006-2010 ~idlm

New Order at Coachella 2005




Yeah, this is a really good song...  love it...


 
This is why events unnerve me,
They find it all, a different story,
Notice whom for wheels are turning,
Turn again and turn towards this time,
All she ask's the strength to hold me,
Then again the same old story,
World will travel, oh so quickly,
Travel first and lean towards this time. Oh, I'll break them down, no mercy shown,
Heaven knows, it's got to be this time,
Watching her, these things she said,
The times she cried,
Too frail to wake this time. Oh I'll break them down, no mercy shown
Heaven knows, it's got to be this time,
Avenues all lined with trees,
Picture me and then you start watching,
Watching forever, forever,
Watching love grow, forever,
Letting me know, forever.


This is a great song...  I remember when it came out...  love it...

 
Brilliant.  Interpol is certainly channeling this era of New Order, but their music is unique and beautiful in its own right.
Never could see the attraction of New Order or Joy Division.  They did nothing for me in the 80's and I still don't get them.  This piece isn't too bad though.


very cool...


 rtb wrote:

Radiohead's version is pretty damn impressive:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xliP7OdBtM
 
nice post, thanks
This typifies "marginal". Did then, does now. Oh, wait, let me take some Valium and drink a few beers. Ahhh. Now I get it.