Venter explains the history of the synthetic field and describes how biological engineering could lead to drastic advances in energy generation, food production, and even evolution.
Location: Teetering on the edge of Avenue D Gender:
Posted:
Feb 10, 2015 - 7:20pm
islander wrote:
You really think I still get mail?
*snerk*
So, to actually add something to this discussion I'll add this:
I just filled out my monthly time sheet. Due to Influenza A, which Augusta contracted first and I got a rip roarin' batch of 12 days later, I lost 6 days of work. No health insurance (couldn't buy Tamiflu for me the week before I got paid at the end of January), no sick leave, and I had the annual flu vaccine (only about 23% effective when Augusta was diagnosed.) I chose to not go to work sick because I could not physically move I was in so much joint pain and I didn't want to get anyone else exposed to what I was clawing my way through. Do I believe in the importance of vaccination? Hell yes. Do I think it's criminal that people have to make a choice between keeping a job, not bringing illness to the workplace, or lost wages because of illness or that of an ill child? Absolutely. Just imagine what another Spanish Influenza would do to the American and worldwide workforce? I just shake my head when I hear individuals say "I don't get the flu shot because I NEVER get sick." Just wait.
(...) "Could we ever eradicate bacterial diseases? No way. Not ever. Bacteria will often colonize people, not causing disease. Neisseria meningitis, for example, will, depending on the season and the population studied, will be found asymptomatically in the throat of up to 35% of people (1). The asymptomatic carriers serve as a source of bacteria that can subsequently be passed on to others, who, for reasons of genetics or bad luck, develop invasive disease."
The problem with building a better vaccine is that mother nature (or evolution or what have you) is constantly and tirelessly working to build a better virus/bacteria. It's like wishing for calorie-free chocolate cake. There will never be a "better" vaccine that will:
A: be 100 percent effective B: Be completely free of side effects C: Never lose potency D: Be very inexpensive to manufacture E: Be effective for the next 30 years against any and all mutations of an infectious agent.
It's nice to dream that science will one day eradicate illnesses of all kinds, including infectious disease, if we just offer a big enough bounty, but it's a pipe dream.
From the Herd Immunity link I provided previously:
"Could we ever eradicate bacterial diseases? No way. Not ever. Bacteria will often colonize people, not causing disease. Neisseria meningitis, for example, will, depending on the season and the population studied, will be found asymptomatically in the throat of up to 35% of people (1). The asymptomatic carriers serve as a source of bacteria that can subsequently be passed on to others, who, for reasons of genetics or bad luck, develop invasive disease."
well on that side i'd like see some other stuff tackled too
but i'm coming from the first do no harm camp
maybe a test to tell if someone will have a reaction or identify a genetic mutation that might predispose a child
or a customized vaccine
utopian?
StevenPinker — ‘We will never have a perfect world, but it’s not romantic or naïve to work toward a better one.’
the short answer for me (or that i'd like to see) is that someone will build a better vaccine (or be incentivized to build a better one)
for lack of a better term personalized medicine
and all of this political posturing will be moot
in the meantime doctors/political leaders really need to make sure parents understand the pros and cons
i'm sure that's happening now to some degree but to let the extremely rare vaccine injury blow this thing out of proportion isn't good
The problem with building a better vaccine is that mother nature (or evolution or what have you) is constantly and tirelessly working to build a better virus/bacteria. It's like wishing for calorie-free chocolate cake. There will never be a "better" vaccine that will:
A: be 100 percent effective B: Be completely free of side effects C: Never lose potency D: Be very inexpensive to manufacture E: Be effective for the next 30 years against any and all mutations of an infectious agent.
It's nice to dream that science will one day eradicate illnesses of all kinds, including infectious disease, if we just offer a big enough bounty, but it's a pipe dream.
From the Herd Immunity link I provided previously:
"Could we ever eradicate bacterial diseases? No way. Not ever. Bacteria will often colonize people, not causing disease. Neisseria meningitis, for example, will, depending on the season and the population studied, will be found asymptomatically in the throat of up to 35% of people (1). The asymptomatic carriers serve as a source of bacteria that can subsequently be passed on to others, who, for reasons of genetics or bad luck, develop invasive disease."
So, hospitals: They can require doctors to scrub up before surgery, right? And wear gloves (potentially exposing themselves to latex allergy) Or can a surgeon refuse to do that and still expect to have a job?
You seem to be mistaking the difference between a job description and terms of employment.
Oh and there have been latex free gloves and medical devices for years ...
So, hospitals: They can require doctors to scrub up before surgery, right? And wear gloves (potentially exposing themselves to latex allergy) Or can a surgeon refuse to do that and still expect to have a job?
I have a cleanliness standard for my employees. I also have an entirely arbitrary standard for t-shirt art.
One is to not do something that is a voluntary act, the other is you must do something involuntarily and to your body.
So, hospitals: They can require doctors to scrub up before surgery, right? And wear gloves (potentially exposing themselves to latex allergy) Or can a surgeon refuse to do that and still expect to have a job?
Just adding some dimension ... in the past couple of years, many hospitals are now demanding employees be vaccinated against the flu or be fired. More than a couple of nurses have said no and walked. I do not know of any pending employment litigation regarding these types of policies. There may be some out there.
But thought this was valid to bring into the conversation.
Our hospital has the rule that all employees must be vaccinated against the flu, but they also have the choice to wear a surgical mask at work during the run of the flu season, which I believe is 7 months of the year. I know a couple who have chosen that route.
I think that's probably the same data I posted down thread a bit. If you look at it, there were 3540 'compensable' claims. But it covers 1989 - 2014. That's barely a couple of hundred a year (definitely less if you take out the statistically large outliers).
I don't think it's a good specific metric, but it does give at least an indication of the scale of the problem. If anything the lawyers and possible windfall rewards would over represent the issue. And using those numbers, it's a non-issue.
i would agree
this is from the mmr vis (vaccine information statement)
4 What are the risks from MMR vaccine?
A vaccine, like any medicine, is capable of causing serious problems, such as severe allergic reactions. The risk of MMR vaccine causing serious harm, or death, is extremely small. Getting MMR vaccine is much safer than getting measles, mumps or rubella. Most people who get MMR vaccine do not have any serious problems with it.
Mild problems • Fever (up to 1 person out of 6) • Mild rash (about 1 person out of 20) • Swelling of glands in the cheeks or neck (about 1 person out of 75) If these problems occur, it is usually within 6-14 days after the shot. They occur less often after the second dose.
Moderate problems • Seizure (jerking or staring) caused by fever (about 1 out of 3,000 doses) • Temporary pain and stiffness in the joints, mostly in teenage or adult women (up to 1 out of 4) • Temporary low platelet count, which can cause a bleeding disorder (about 1 out of 30,000 doses)
Severe problems (very rare) • Serious allergic reaction (less than 1 out of a million doses) • Several other severe problems have been reported after a child gets MMR vaccine, including: - Deafness - Long-term seizures, coma, or lowered consciousness - Permanent brain damage
These are so rare that it is hard to tell whether they are caused by the vaccine.
I got into a "discussion" at the other place with someone who was using vaccination lawsuit data to "prove" that vaccinations have injured more than 4k children, and killed over 600. That's the difference. Where do you get your data?
I think that's probably the same data I posted down thread a bit. If you look at it, there were 3540 'compensable' claims. But it covers 1989 - 2014. That's barely a couple of hundred a year (definitely less if you take out the statistically large outliers).
I don't think it's a good specific metric, but it does give at least an indication of the scale of the problem. If anything the lawyers and possible windfall rewards would over represent the issue. And using those numbers, it's a non-issue.
It's valid. I wish they'd pass that rule where I work. You can pass a rule saying no smoking in the workplace, what's the difference?
I got into a "discussion" at the other place with someone who was using vaccination lawsuit data to "prove" that vaccinations have injured more than 4k children, and killed over 600. That's the difference. Where do you get your data?
Just adding some dimension ... in the past couple of years, many hospitals are now demanding employees be vaccinated against the flu or be fired. More than a couple of nurses have said no and walked. I do not know of any pending employment litigation regarding these types of policies. There may be some out there.
But thought this was valid to bring into the conversation.
It's valid. I wish they'd pass that rule where I work. You can pass a rule saying no smoking in the workplace, what's the difference?
I am surprised by this. I suppose some people thought vaccines were already compulsory, but I did not. And I am only now becoming aware of any movement that they should be compulsory (by law).
It looks like the upshot of the article is that they agree that compulsory is justified, but most people wonder just how to implement that law. I think the intense pressure/derision antivax people are feeling will suffice, in the long run, along with schools etc. requiring proof of vax before enrollment.
the short answer for me (or that i'd like to see) is that someone will build a better vaccine (or be incentivized to build a better one)
for lack of a better term personalized medicine
and all of this political posturing will be moot
in the meantime doctors/political leaders really need to make sure parents understand the pros and cons
i'm sure that's happening now to some degree but to let the extremely rare vaccine injury blow this thing out of proportion isn't good
I am surprised by this. I suppose some people thought vaccines were already compulsory, but I did not. And I am only now becoming aware of any movement that they should be compulsory (by law).
It looks like the upshot of the article is that they agree that compulsory is justified, but most people wonder just how to implement that law. I think the intense pressure/derision antivax people are feeling will suffice, in the long run, along with schools etc. requiring proof of vax before enrollment.
Just adding some dimension ... in the past couple of years, many hospitals are now demanding employees be vaccinated against the flu or be fired. More than a couple of nurses have said no and walked. I do not know of any pending employment litigation regarding these types of policies. There may be some out there.
But thought this was valid to bring into the conversation.
...it seems like everyone’s talking about compulsory vaccination,
I am surprised by this. I suppose some people thought vaccines were already compulsory, but I did not. And I am only now becoming aware of any movement that they should be compulsory (by law).
It looks like the upshot of the article is that they agree that compulsory is justified, but most people wonder just how to implement that law. I think the intense pressure/derision antivax people are feeling will suffice, in the long run, along with schools etc. requiring proof of vax before enrollment.
