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It'll be interesting how Ukraine and other European states respond. There's not much love lost between Europe and Trump anymore. And Ukraine is becoming increasingly independent of US supplies. That was the one real benefit of Trump's tenure. He's weaned us off the US defence umbrella. He's also exposed how weak the NATO defence network is in the face of the new realities of war. Europe is actually being better protected by Ukraine now than it was under Trump, so yeah, thanks for all the fish and all that. I'd rather trust Ukraine than Hegeseth.
Is the Iran War breaking NATO forever? Trump is lashing out at allies as European partners increasingly turn away from his war â all signs that this is more than just a situational divide
(...) The longer the Iran war goes on, the greater will be the pressure in Europe to cut a deal with Iran â especially if European establishments have come to believe that the NATO guarantee of U.S. military protection no longer holds.
Lastly, there is the question of what Trump does after the Iran War. It has been suggested â let us hope wrongly â that one way in which he could distract attention from failure in Iran, and gain some compensation for it, might be by seizing Greenland. This would end NATO, for no alliance can survive an open attack by its leading member on another one; and after all, Russia has not claimed a single inch of NATO territory.
If the U.S. no longer defends and instead attacks Europe, and Europe no longer acts as an airstrip for U.S. force projection elsewhere in the world, then the basic rationales for NATOâs existence will have vanished.
First, someone needs to take the lead on informing Trump what NATO actually is and what it was set up to do.
Is the Iran War breaking NATO forever? Trump is lashing out at allies as European partners increasingly turn away from his war â all signs that this is more than just a situational divide
(...) The longer the Iran war goes on, the greater will be the pressure in Europe to cut a deal with Iran â especially if European establishments have come to believe that the NATO guarantee of U.S. military protection no longer holds.
Lastly, there is the question of what Trump does after the Iran War. It has been suggested â let us hope wrongly â that one way in which he could distract attention from failure in Iran, and gain some compensation for it, might be by seizing Greenland. This would end NATO, for no alliance can survive an open attack by its leading member on another one; and after all, Russia has not claimed a single inch of NATO territory.
If the U.S. no longer defends and instead attacks Europe, and Europe no longer acts as an airstrip for U.S. force projection elsewhere in the world, then the basic rationales for NATOâs existence will have vanished.
Your regime-changing/nation-building projects have expiration dates.
Good times. I think he's merely trying to extort more money with fearmongering. NATO is a US tool (see Rutte a few posts down).
As for Ukraine, it could end sooner or it might not.
That's still not an answer, so I'll repeat the question: is it a good thing or bad thing that Donald Trump is trying to wreck NATO?
Didn't ask about Ukraine, but your quote mined snippet is telling about the intellectual honesty you bring to any debate. If Zelenskyy favored your solution to the war in Ukraine—capitulation—it's within his power and he would have done it years ago. He's arguing for enough allied support to repel Russia rather than the drip feed/life support he's getting.
More like a bad thing for your kind of hegemonic cheerleaders. The rest already knew that every Operation US Good Thing eventually has to come to an end.
What?
Seriously, what are you trying to say? Is it a good or bad thing that Trump is doing his best to wreck NATO?
Sounds just like the outcome you've been cheerleading for. Are you saying this is now a bad thing?
More like a bad thing for your kind of hegemonic cheerleaders. The rest already knew that every Operation US Good Thing eventually has to come to an end.
The Pentagon notified Congress it plans to redirect roughly $750 million from the Prioritized Ukraine Requirements List (PURL)âa NATO-backed program funding U.S.-made weapons for Kyivâto replenish American stockpiles instead, the Washington Post reported.
Officials said the move reflects shortages of key air defense systems like Patriot and THAAD after heavy use in the Middle East, meaning future Ukraine packages may be thinner on critical interceptors. It remains unclear whether European allies understood their contributions could be used this way.
The shift comes as President Donald Trump spent the day publicly attacking NATO, calling it a âpaper tigerâ and claiming on Truth Social that NATO allies have done âABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO HELP WITH⦠IRAN.â
He said the U.S. would ârememberâ which countries did not step up, casting NATO as failing Washington rather than the other way around.
Sounds just like the outcome you've been cheerleading for. Are you saying this is now a bad thing?
The Pentagon notified Congress it plans to redirect roughly $750 million from the Prioritized Ukraine Requirements List (PURL)âa NATO-backed program funding U.S.-made weapons for Kyivâto replenish American stockpiles instead, the Washington Post reported.
Officials said the move reflects shortages of key air defense systems like Patriot and THAAD after heavy use in the Middle East, meaning future Ukraine packages may be thinner on critical interceptors. It remains unclear whether European allies understood their contributions could be used this way.
The shift comes as President Donald Trump spent the day publicly attacking NATO, calling it a âpaper tigerâ and claiming on Truth Social that NATO allies have done âABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO HELP WITH⦠IRAN.â
He said the U.S. would ârememberâ which countries did not step up, casting NATO as failing Washington rather than the other way around.
Rutte also tried to frame the war as a necessity and called on Americans to back President Trump, saying: âIâve seen the polling, but I really hope the American people will be with him, because heâs doing this to make the whole world safe.â
âIâve seen the poodeling, but I really hope the American people will be no poodles."
I know that in the end, we all are.
Here's to the marijuana capitol of the world!
Spare me the garlic though, cause I seem to get pimples from the mouth-wash.
..
Rutte also tried to frame the war as a necessity and called on Americans to back President Trump, saying: âIâve seen the polling, but I really hope the American people will be with him, because heâs doing this to make the whole world safe.â
trying to shame our NATO allies into submitting to a military op (warship escorts thru Hormuz) that cannot succeed, gives encouragement to Iran to stay the course, confirming that their strategy of dragging the war out, keeping the Straits closed, and the price of oil high, is working.
This also is a dangerous signal to our allies, no doubt making the question, seriously, whether the leader of the West's biggest military & economic power, is in full control of his mental faculties.
That's not an insulting stmt, its a sobering, legitimate question.
Of all the people here you chose Lazy8 to accuse of nefarious government practices and pernicious nation-building? 
