black321 wrote: 
yep....the current system does one thing.......Makes insurance companies richer and richer and ultimately more powerful.

Right, eliminating the mandate gets us to the worst of both worlds....the sickest will get the insurance, and the healthy wont, so premiums will rise.  Then when the healthy inevitably get sick, they'll go to the emergency rooms and drive up bad debt/costs.  Either support it, or repeal it completely and dont force docs to serve those who can't pay...at least then we know what type of world we live in. (I agree with universal coverage).

 cc_rider wrote: 
should be part of our taxes like the rest of the world.  Shouldn't depend on how sick or healthy one is.  It's a fact of life, we all need health coverage! Oh and car insurance too :)

 Steely_D wrote: 
The thing is, medical providers (ERs) are required by law to treat people, regardless of insurance coverage.

https://law.freeadvice.com/malpractice_law/hospital_malpractice/hospital-patients.htm

So who pays for that treatment?

People want it both ways: they don't want to pay for insurance when they are healthy, but IF they get sick or injured, they demand health care. It's classic cognitive dissonance.

 miamizsun wrote: 
Just like we're mandated to get car insurance, it's OK to mandate health insurance. The whole point behind insurance (besides the coverage) is the shared pool. We all pay in, including the people that aren't sick, and that helps keep costs down for the ill.

I'm a great driver, but still pay into the kitty. It's there if I need it, and I hope I don't. But that's what insurance is: prepaying for something so you're covered later.
I suppose an alternate perspective is: don't buy insurance but you also don't get to draw from the health care resources that others are paying into (Medicare, etc) when you need it - and you might end up destitute or dead because you are denied coverage.

We could even step back a bit further and say that there are too many people on the planet. Lack of health insurance coverage might get a few of them off it, leaving more resources for the ones that can pay. Maybe universal health care is a mistake...

 black321 wrote: 
one way you tell if it's bs?

if it comes out dc, chances are, it's bs

of course it has to be purposely complicated, otherwise we might understand it

my first take is that the corporate rate is going down which is is generally going to level the playing field (this might fall into the somewhat good category, we'll see)

the best thing the corporate control freaks could do would be to start decontrolling business, eliminating really bad rules and regs and make it easier to start and operate a business (produce much needed goods and services)

simplify, simplify, simplify (make the pie bigger)

then worry about lowering rates

the personal side appears to be the usual duocratic bs, complicated and loaded with special porky goodness

or as the current wing says "a christmas gift"

it's more like a christmas tree with covered with their favorite ornaments 



edit: there is one thing, if it is true, that would be good

eliminating the mandate (not forcing people to purchase a product or service)

 Coaxial wrote: 
At&t also wants to merge with time warner...there will undoubtedly be some job gains and benefits to labor from the cuts, but also many PR moments, like i suspect with AT&T.

 black321 wrote: 
If AT&T is giving away 2 million in bonuses you can imagine the impact of their tax cut.Farkers.

So the tax plan is going down...but didnt don promise it wouldn't benefit the rich and there would be tax cuts for everyone?  Sounds like a "you can keep your healthplan" moment for trump.

And if you opposed the cuts, and you benefit, why not give that extra cash to your favorite charity?

 islander wrote: 
i dunno

according to some local coffee talk, the poles are reversing and the earth is going to spin off of its axis

orbit change?

you know fear, anger and resentment are some of the worst emotions

making decisions based on that stuff is pants

i think we should sit down and think about what we really want

pro tip: if it involves initiating violence or coercion on peaceful people we're doing it wrong

 aflanigan wrote: 




Or is it Ruth Bader Ginsburg and Scalia's love child?......mind......blown

 miamizsun wrote: 
one of my faves.   I met him in Aspen 2 decades ago. A funny and nice guy.

 aflanigan wrote: 

 miamizsun wrote: 
I'm not sure. Is that Antonin Scalia, before Ruth Bader Ginsburg took pity on him and invited him into the Supreme Court building to get warm and sober up?

 islander wrote: 
You recognize the gif?

 aflanigan wrote: 
Walter is Wayne's dad wiseacre. 

 miamizsun wrote: 
I think he said read history, but I'm ready for history too.

And I'm with Miami. As much of an asshat as he is, we will survive Trump, just as we have survived all of his predecessors. 

 miamizsun wrote: 
I say in all the years that I've skated through ready history, I have yet to see tom hanks pass the puck to walter gretzky.

 miamizsun wrote: 


As Abe Lincoln once said, 

 sirdroseph wrote: 
Dude, you should really develop a sense of humor. Especially with the holidays rapidly approaching.